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I have both a v6 and ls1 camaros. Obviously the LS1 is a lot faster, but I know the 3800 can hold down some power. I saw a 3.8 firebird run 9's. That would make my LS1 look petty. I think what some people, including Bird_of_prey are trying to get at, is that with all the money it takes to make a v6 fast, you could have started with something fast and kept the extra money, because it takes a lot more to make the v6 'fast'. Sure this is a v6 board, but it is also the lounge. People can talk about whatever they want. I have learned a lot from this board, so I try to drop in often. Seems though it is always a 'my **** is bigger than yours' contest. Can't we all just get along? :)
i completely agree with this.. not to mention that the v6 sounds like absolute crap.
Fact of the matter is, there is guys with the 3.8 running low 12's without a ton of money into the motor...look at LNorton on FTv6...cam only running 12.3. I gurantee you he's spent less money on his setup then what it will cost you to do that swap and make a 13 second car at best.
I would love to run the cam he does...and now that I got manley valves, I may just look further into running that cam...
....I havent done much reading into the swap, but would you not need a different transmission as well, I dont believe our bellhousing bolts up to the v8 motors?
Now that is impressive!
I am pretty sure you will need a 4L60e bellhousing. What if you want a Manual? You will probably need a 6speed which is another 1000.00 + dollars not including flywheel and clutch assembly. You will probably also need an exhaust system since the V6 exhaust system will probably not bolt up to it. Thats another 200-500 dollars at least. How about your gauge cluster? I know that the V6 and V8 clusters are different. If you want to see acurate oil PSI and RPMS/MPH you will probably have to run a LS1 cluster which is another 50-100 at least. If you are doing a 6speed you will have to get another center console for the 6 speed. They run 50-100 also. LS1 air lid since the V6 is on the side and the LS1 is in the middle. Thats another 50-100 dollars. Are the fuel pumps the same for a V6 and LSX? What about the K-member?
Jeff ..
1998 Firebird.. Built 3.8 with a 125 shot.. 370rwhp,415rwtq.. stock tune!! sold
that would be alright but you can somewhat tell what your getting with a used motor. unless i was buying a turbo from someone I knew, I'm not sure I would trust a used turbo being any good.
I am still debating between the swap or a turbo kit. not in a hurry right now so I have plenty of time to think about it.
Since we are talking about used V8 motors why not get a used turbo kit? I have seen them for 2000.00 or less.
This is similar to what I'm planning. Swap one, turbo another. One made for the the autocross/backroads, the other for the track. May be backwards to some, but sounds like fun to me. ;)
'99 Camaro
'04 Saab 9-3 Aero
'90 Audi Coupe Quattro
This is what we know from those motors. All those motors listed have over 90,000 miles and were in trucks. You cant hear them running so how do you know if they are in good shape?
I bought a Junkyard motor for my V6 firebird back in 2002. I got it for 1000.00 dollars. The only reason I got a junkyard motor is because they still had it in the car so you can hear it running and it only had 15,000 miles on it. They had motors in the junkyard for 300-400 dollars but they had 100,000 plus miles on them, were on shelves, and I wanted a motor that I knew worked and didnt have a crap ton of miles on it. I didnt want to deal with getting a motor back to my house which was 125 mile drive from the junkyard, then have it installed to find out it had a rod knock. Yes the motors came with a warrenty but I didnt want to deal with pulling the motor again and driving it back up there to get my money back and still be left with a car without a motor.
You can pretty much tell if a turbo is good or not by the feel of the impeller and the looks of the kit. There is other issues that you cant see but it's way less to get a turbo rebuilt or just to get another turbo if the one you have is not in good working order. I am no Turbo expert but I know if I was looking at a used kit I know some people who can come with me to tell me if everything is good or not. You cant really do that with a motor sitting on a shelf in a warehouse that came from a wrecked truck or flooded out truck. All you can do is drop it in your car and hope it starts and holds good oil pressure and doesnt knock. Thats the scariest part about swapping motors. I did it 2 times with my V6 and was nervous each time we started them up.
This is similar to what I'm planning. Swap one, turbo another. One made for the the autocross/backroads, the other for the track. May be backwards to some, but sounds like fun to me. ;)
Good for you. Good luck with that. sounds like it would be something fun and the car would be a different car with each turbo.
Jeff ..
1998 Firebird.. Built 3.8 with a 125 shot.. 370rwhp,415rwtq.. stock tune!! sold
are you about done crying over this yet? we get it you love v6s. whatever floats your boat. i wont even get into the rediculousness of your comparing the sound of a cammed v6 to a couple of stock ls1 and lt1s.
current car- 95 Trans am- bolt ons, parked and collecting dust. why? because **** it
I've been wanting to do a v8 swap for awhile. Initially looking into the LS1's but there pretty damn expensive and then I saw somewhere that you could use the 5.3, 6.0 out of the trucks and swap a few parts and it's essentially the same thing. Just haven't looked into what those parts are yet. Even if I was to buy a LS1 and swap it into my Camaro the total price for me would be less than finding a V8 Camaro around here not too mention far more fun.
are you about done crying over this yet? we get it you love v6s. whatever floats your boat. i wont even get into the rediculousness of your comparing the sound of a cammed v6 to a couple of stock ls1 and lt1s.
The Lt1 has some bolt ons but my LS1 is a little cammed now also and has been for about a year now. My V6 still sounded better then my LS1 does.
I cant believe you were a V6 f-body owner. If you dont like me praising a 3.8 V6 motor on a V6 F-body site then Why are you on here?
The Lt1 has some bolt ons but my LS1 is a little cammed now also and has been for about a year now. My V6 still sounded better then my LS1 does.
I cant believe you were a V6 f-body owner. If you dont like me praising a 3.8 V6 motor on a V6 F-body site then Why are you on here if you dont like the V6 motors?
Nothing at all wrong with praising the 3800. It's always served me well. However, you need to have your hearing checked if you think a V6 sounds at all better than cammed LSx. Drop the mindless whiny drivel. It was old 4 pages ago. This is the natural progression. Doesn't matter if you like it or not, it's a fact, everyone moves up and on.
My LSx swap may be middle of the road to you, however I can assure you, it's not. My goal by the end of the season is to be on the LS1tech top 50 stock internal list. Just cause I can. I'm a converter swap and suspension change away.
Next up comes the SI nitrous list. I should fare pretty well there, since I'm not afraid to throw 250 at my 150k mile junkyard motor that I never heard run before I installed it in the Camaro. Should be able to do it concurrently with the other list.
Then next season comes racing NHRA Super Stock. I'm going legit. Why, just cause I can. However, NONE of this can be done in a V6, thus necessitating my conversion. I'm still here solving v6 problems, offering my 15+ years of advice, just to help people out.
Posing an open ended question shouldn't get your panties in such a knot. You need some form of stress management. This isn't some sort of taboo subject, just open conversation that you have taken to a level of dripping ****ness the likes this board hasn't seen in a while. Think about it.
who the hell says i dont? have i said once that i dont? dont go trying to put words in my mouth. im just tired of you and your 4 page soap box standing, pissing and moaning over why some of us moved (or plan to move) on to bigger things and you want to act as if you didnt do the same damn thing for years. but you want to sit on your perpetual high horse and act as if we turned our backs on the v6 community by doing so and youre some lone warrior of v6 support.
if i didnt like the v6 why in gods name would i have volunteered to be a moderator here for the past 4 years or even still be here 5 years after i traded mine in? or wasted countless hours helping new guys get their ducks in a row modding? or time ive invested talking v6 guys ive met around here locally and pulling them in here and helping them anyway i can to improve on their cars? dont you ever doubt my support for the v6 community, ive been banned from a **** load of sites over arguments about what they can and cant do.
current car- 95 Trans am- bolt ons, parked and collecting dust. why? because **** it
Nothing at all wrong with praising the 3800. It's always served me well. However, you need to have your hearing checked if you think a V6 sounds at all better than cammed LSx. Drop the mindless whiny drivel. It was old 4 pages ago. This is the natural progression. Doesn't matter if you like it or not, it's a fact, everyone moves up and on.
My LSx swap may be middle of the road to you, however I can assure you, it's not. My goal by the end of the season is to be on the LS1tech top 50 stock internal list. Just cause I can. I'm a converter swap and suspension change away.
Next up comes the SI nitrous list. I should fare pretty well there, since I'm not afraid to throw 250 at my 150k mile junkyard motor that I never heard run before I installed it in the Camaro. Should be able to do it concurrently with the other list.
Then next season comes racing NHRA Super Stock. I'm going legit. Why, just cause I can. However, NONE of this can be done in a V6, thus necessitating my conversion. I'm still here solving v6 problems, offering my 15+ years of advice, just to help people out.
Posing an open ended question shouldn't get your panties in such a knot. You need some form of stress management. This isn't some sort of taboo subject, just open conversation that you have taken to a level of dripping ****ness the likes this board hasn't seen in a while. Think about it.
Damn. I struck a nerve with you and your other little friend. My bad. You are absolutly right. A V6 can not do anything a LS1 can do. I understand now why you moved on. To crack the top 50 stock internal LS1 list is very impressive. What is that? Low 11's? Something like you stated above that the V6 can not do.
The way it is worded your open ended question and the way you still dog the V6 compared to your almighty LS1 is what gets me. Do you hear yourself at all? NONE of this can be done in a V6! From running Low 11's to being a legit NHRA race car I guess. None of it can be done in a V6..
Everyone moves up and on? I went from a Built 3.8 on N20 to a stock 3.4. I dont consider that moving up. Yes it was a couple of years between V6's but the 1st chance I got on the best deal that we could afford I picked up another one.
And as far as my V6 sounding better. I got more compliments in my 98 firebird with the way it sounded then I do in my WS6. More people thought my Firebird was a H/C Formula. Thats the altimate compliment. I use to bet people that my car was a V6 because they didnt believe me that it wasnt a LS1. I seriously use to bet a dollar that my car had a V6 in it and when I popped the hood I would be a dollar richer. My car had no badges except for a WS6 emblem in the back that I got when I did the WS6 hood and airbox setup.
Bottom line. This is the internet and its fun every now and then to have these kinds of discussions.
Jeff ..
1998 Firebird.. Built 3.8 with a 125 shot.. 370rwhp,415rwtq.. stock tune!! sold
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