Prop 8 poll

[Mighty Thor]

You know other sites are talking about this. I'm surprise none of us have started this. So I'm going start.

Well Prop 8 which defines marriage to be only between a man and a woman is going out the window here in California starting tomorrow.

Ofcourse Calif. is a very liberal state and believe it or not the majority of Californians, which to my surprise, supported a conservative view of marriage by 53%. A judge from San Francisco overturned this, but the funny thing is the media failed to mention that this judge was gay. So this could have been a personal agenda. Also a dozen or so celebrities like Brad Pitt donated a ton of money on this in support of overturning it.



If you guys are interested in reading up on this here's a small summarized article:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/0..._n_671018.html




It'd be interesting what you guys think about gay marriage. Since this is the US we must honor the freedom of speech.

**please don't attack or make comments over someone's opinion on this. Make your own comment. So this way it doesn't get out of hand** Let's put this to a vote.

[cam98aro]

Re: Prop 8 poll

this is not going to end well

[Heywood]

Re: Prop 8 poll

If this country were ruled only by "tradition", women would have no rights and we'd all own slaves.

Same sex marriage in no way infringes on the rights of others. People simply disagree with it. Therefore, by banning it altogether, we'd be infringing on the first amendment rights of homosexuals. Not only would such a law banning same-sex marriage be a violation of ones right to free speech, it would be completely against the "separation of church and state" ideology specifically stated in our constitution.

[sac2165]

Re: Prop 8 poll

Constitutionally, this should be a no-brainer - - A group of people are being denied rights based on their sexual orientation.

On the other hand, if the people VOTE to make their stance known the government should leave it alone. There is something wrong when the government will just overturn what the people Voted for just because a few people make a fuss over it.

[Heywood]

Re: Prop 8 poll

Constitutionally, this should be a no-brainer - - A group of people are being denied rights based on their sexual orientation.

On the other hand, if the people VOTE to make their stance known the government should leave it alone. There is something wrong when the government will just overturn what the people Voted for just because a few people make a fuss over it.

Majority vote holds little sway over constitutional issues since the U.S. constitution serves to protect the minority from the majority. It's times like these that I'm glad we have the constitution. I mean, what else would protect the rights of the minority? By definition they could never obtain the majority vote on their own...

[venom3300]

Re: Prop 8 poll

Not only would such a law banning same-sex marriage be a violation of ones right to free speech, it would be completely against the "separation of church and state" ideology specifically stated in our constitution.

an Atheist that believes in evolution would probably not support gay marriage. It is simply unnatural. two men cannot have a baby, neither can two women, it is that way for a reason... regardless of religion.

[Heywood]

Re: Prop 8 poll

an Atheist that believes in evolution would probably not support gay marriage.

As an atheist that believes in evolution, I find that generalization pretty funny. Most of my friends are either atheist or agnostic and fully support gay marriage. With no religious affiliation, there's no book telling us gay marriage is wrong.

It is simply unnatural. two men cannot have a baby, neither can two women, it is that way for a reason... regardless of religion.

So sex is only for procreation? By the same reasoning, law should prohibit sex before marriage, and ban contraceptives altogether. If sex is only for making children as you say (and not for "fun"), then wouldn't such laws make sense?

Also, does this mean you believe same sex couples only have sex for fun (since they cannot procreate), i.e. they don't use sex/physical contact to show their love for each other?

[dmw319]

Re: Prop 8 poll

this is not going to end well

my thoughts exactly

[ssms5411]

Re: Prop 8 poll

I voted man & woman, just becuase its true, if everyone was gay in the begining we would of all have died off from old age a very long time ago.

[Pewter02Camaro]

Re: Prop 8 poll

It'd be interesting what you guys think about gay marriage. Since this is the US we must honor the freedom of speech.

**please don't attack or make comments over someone's opinion on this. Make your own comment. So this way it doesn't get out of hand** Let's put this to a vote.

Oh well, that lasted long... :rolleyes:

[venom3300]

Re: Prop 8 poll

With no religious affiliation, there's no book telling us gay marriage is wrong.

as stated, you dont need a book. look at anatomy. clearly men and women should be together to insure offspring.

So sex is only for procreation? By the same reasoning, law should prohibit sex before marriage, and ban contraceptives altogether. If sex is only for making children as you say (and not for "fun"), then wouldn't such laws make sense?

Please highlight where i said sex is only for procreation? I did not.
My point is that sex between a man and women is need in order to produce children, thus making marriage between man and woman the natural choice.

Also, does this mean you believe same sex couples only have sex for fun (since they cannot procreate), i.e. they don't use sex/physical contact to show their love for each other?

I dont know what they do, nor do I care. however, they can continue to do it outside of the institution of marriage.

[ssms5411]

Re: Prop 8 poll

Its nature, how many animals pair up that are of the same sex? Then look at how many pair up that are the opposite sex.

[Mogobs30th]

Re: Prop 8 poll

an Atheist that believes in evolution would probably not support gay marriage. It is simply unnatural. two men cannot have a baby, neither can two women, it is that way for a reason... regardless of religion.

Lets be honest here, you're the LAST person that should talk about the ideas and opinions of an Atheist, nor does your comment have anything to do with Atheism. It wreaks of Christianity. What you don't understand is that evolution and nature eliminates that which is different or that which cannot sustain itself. Take for example a giraffe. Some hundreds of thousands of years ago, they probably looked like horses, but due to their environment, the ones with the longer necks survived, the ones with the shorter ones died off and didnt procreate. So today, we are left with odd looking long necked horses.

Same goes for every species of life on this planet. By putting this into the human species, some people have certain traits that will eliminate them from the evolutionary race, due to heredity, environment, sexual orientation, whatever. Most of the people in the world are heterosexual males and females, a few are not. The ones that are not, nature has found a way to deal with them. Thru evolution, those who are destined not to procreate and create children will not evolve or carry on their genes thru the evolutionary journey. Those who cannot pass their genes on cannot evolve, those who can pass their genes on WILL evolve.

Any true forward-thinker believes that everything in nature is natural. Everything here is natural. This is what I believe. If you're gay, then its natures way of eliminating your genes from the evolutionary journey.

As for Prop 8, Heywood hit it on the mark. The govt is supposed to help the minority against the majority at times, but I would also like to see how large that majority is that voted for Prop 8.

[venom3300]

Re: Prop 8 poll

Lets be honest here, you're the LAST person that should talk about the ideas and opinions of an Atheist, nor does your comment have anything to do with Atheism. It wreaks of Christianity.

oh really? i have always been Christian.

What you don't understand is that evolution and nature eliminates that which is different or that which cannot sustain itself. Take for example a giraffe. Some hundreds of thousands of years ago, they probably looked like horses, but due to their environment, the ones with the longer necks survived, the ones with the shorter ones died off and didnt procreate. So today, we are left with odd looking long necked horses.

i am well aware of how evolution works. this is in my field of study at college.

Same goes for every species of life on this planet. By putting this into the human species, some people have certain traits that will eliminate them from the evolutionary race, due to heredity, environment, sexual orientation, whatever. Most of the people in the world are heterosexual males and females, a few are not. The ones that are not, nature has found a way to deal with them. Thru evolution, those who are destined not to procreate and create children will not evolve or carry on their genes thru the evolutionary journey. Those who cannot pass their genes on cannot evolve, those who can pass their genes on WILL evolve.

the problem is that with gay marriage, children are made to think gay is right, and so the idea is fostered my nurture not nature..... but thats another debate in itself

[Mogobs30th]

Re: Prop 8 poll

i am well aware of how evolution works. this is in my field of study at college.

How could you ever study something you simply don't understand, nor wish to understand, unless you're not studying evolution, you're studying theology. So what are you studying?

the problem is that with gay marriage, children are made to think gay is right, and so the idea is fostered my nurture not nature..... but thats another debate in itself

Read my last post, I just explained it to you. Someone studying evolution would know this.