got pulled over.......need advice

['94firebirdv6]

well i was driving to my cousins house to work on his car and i was a little upset...not really paying attention when i see a state hwy patrolman in the other lane slam on his brkaes and do a 180. i looked down and could see i was speeding but i didnt know by how much because my speedo is off due to my gears. so i think to myself oh sh*t i just got another ticket....well after tailing me for about a half mile(checking my plates i guess) he finally puts on the lights and i pull over.
Our conversation:
Me: is there a problem officer?
Him: yeah, i got you for speeding.
Me: really? how fast was i going?
Him: i clocked u at 71 in a 55....is there a reason u were traveling at such a high rate of speed?
Me: well i wasnt aware i was going that fast.....im a little upset i just recieved some bad news about my family.
Him: well im sorry to here that...normally i would just give a warning but since u were going so fast i have to issue a citation for speeding.

he walks back to his car and i start thinking how ive read here and alot of other places how the officer has to show u the reading on the radar gun and since he was moving in the opposite direction maybe he didnt really get me.
he comes back ticket in hand.

Me: officer, u said u clocked me on radar?
Him: yes is there a problem?
Me: no except i really dont think i was going that fast...im not saying i dont beleive you, but would you mind showing me the reading on the radar gun of what you clocked me at?
Him: well....um...u see the thing is i already erased the reading from the gun, but if u like, i could show u how everything works in the cruiser.
Me: no thanks, i just wanted to see the reading.

at this time im thinking to myself YES!!!! theres a chance i might be able to get out of this. but i want to make sure....

Me: well officer the reason i wanted to see the reading is that from where i recently had gears installed in my car, my spedometer is not accurate.
Him: what do u mean?
Me: well say for example i was actually going 60mph my spedometer would read about 70mph because of the lower ratio gears i have than stock.i know i might have been speeding but i know i wasnt going 70 mph because i had my spedometer set at 70 which would mean i was going about 60 in a 55.
Him: what makes u believe all that about your gears?
Me: when i had them installed, my mechanic told me that my spedometer would be about 10mph faster than my actual speed.
Him: well i wouldnt trust your mechanic then (he hands me the ticket) im sorry about whatever is going on in your family.

well some info on me: im 16, turn 17 in july. my only other ticket was last august when i went left to center about a week after first getting my liscence. I went to a Ohio program called "Carteens" and the violation was cleared from my record. I read in my rulebook that they give you to study for your permit test and it said that if you are a first time speeding offender that any speed in excess of 75mph on a 55mph hwy is 2 points on ur liscence, anything less than 75 is 0 points...so thats good news. what are the chances of me having the charges dropped or at least reduced? should i get a lawyer? my court date is in about 2 weeks and even if i dont get the charges dropped whats the maximum penalty? i really do not want to lose my liscence over this and i cant afford an insurance increase....i would REALLY appreciate any advice you guys can give me.

[99V6Camaro]

Im not expert but i would think that if u showed up in court and told the judge that he couldnt prove it was on his radar you have a chance of gettin off.

[Everglades W68]

Run! Run like hell! I hear Wyoming is easy on us speeders.


But seriously, I think you should go to court. You gave a very matter-of-fact explanation of what transpired and you sound very intelligent and polite. I would think you have a decent chance of getting a better outcome.

[tWiStEdBird]

Originally posted by Everglades W68:

But seriously, I think you should go to court. You gave a very matter-of-fact explanation of what transpired and you sound very intelligent and polite. I would think you have a decent chance of getting a better outcome.

x2, go to court.

[Dan M]

From what I've heard, the radar is actually just a confirmation for the Officer's visual estimate. I say bend over and take it.

[L32Projekt]

Fight it. The cop should be able to visually estimate the speed you were going, but only to assist in making sure the radar isn't giving false readings.

Part of radar certification is being able to be tested on visual speed estimates w/in 3 mph of the actual speed and radar reading, at least for us slobs here at Buckley. Sounds like he wasn't expecting someone to call him out on a radar reading, because he didn't actually use it. If he was oncoming and moving, visual estimate isn't enough (I know I'm not that accurate!).

[camaro_speedemon]

Originally posted by L32Projekt:
Fight it. The cop should be able to visually estimate the speed you were going, but only to assist in making sure the radar isn't giving false readings.

Part of radar certification is being able to be tested on visual speed estimates w/in 3 mph of the actual speed and radar reading, at least for us slobs here at Buckley. Sounds like he wasn't expecting someone to call him out on a radar reading, because he didn't actually use it. If he was oncoming and moving, visual estimate isn't enough (I know I'm not that accurate!).

I agree. Most states, if not all, require the cop to visually estimate your speed before using a speed detection device. If he was traveling in the opposite direction, there isn't a chance in hell that he could estimate, aim and clock you before you passed him. I figured this out once, I wanna say if both vehicles are travelling at ~70 MPH, a combined speed of 140MPH, by the time he was close enough to clock you within the margin of error for the radar gun, the cop would have less then 3 or 4 seconds to estimate, aim and fire all while safely operating his crusier. But don't quote me on that time. He either thought you were speeding, or had his radar gun turned on and saw you were speeding.

Secondly, were you the only car on the road? If not, how could he accurately aim his gun directly at you, and be 100% sure it was your car if he was driving in the opposite direction? Florida states the "speed detection device" must have a "unabstructed view" of your car to issue a citation. If you can get the cop to admit there was any other car on the road travelling in either direction, then you stand to get it thrown out. Radar guns will return the speed of the largest radar signature. That means, if there was any other car near you, he could have clocked them instead of you.

I think you stand a pretty good chance of getting it thrown out in court.

Also, remember with a gear swap, the faster you are traveling, the farther off your speedometer will read ;) It may be 10 MPH off at 30MPH, but be 15-20 MPH off at 60 MPH.

You might want to find a cop and tell them you just had your differential replaced and your mechanic said your speedometer will be off becasue of the gear change. Go the speed limit and have the cop clock you with his radar gun. Then go back to the cop, and have him tell you how fast you were going and you will get an estimate of how far off your speedo will be.

Another alternative would be to find a gear ratio calculator online, and punch in your RPM, tranny ratio, and final drive in. It will tell you how fast you are really going.

Here's one you can use, but you will have to register to use the calculator.
http://www.smokemup.com/auto_math/mph_range.php

Here's a rough estimate for you, based on your sig, your running 18" wheels and 3.73's. I guessed your tire size is 275/45
</font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">RPM 1st 2nd 3rd 4th 5th 6th
1000 6 10 15 21 29 0
1500 8 14 22 32 44 0
2000 11 19 30 42 58 0
2500 14 24 37 53 73 0
3000 17 29 45 63 88 0
3500 20 34 52 74 102 0
4000 22 38 60 84 117 0
4500 25 43 67 95 132 0
5000 28 48 75 105 146 0
5500 31 53 82 116 161 0
6000 34 58 90 126 175 0
6500 36 62 97 137 190 0
7000 39 67 105 147 205 0
7500 42 72 112 158 219 0
8000 45 77 119 168 234 0</pre>[/QUOTE]If you can't recalibrate your speedo, learn to tell your speed by your RPM.

[ June 17, 2005, 03:37 AM: Message edited by: camaro_speedemon ]

[Antman]

Radar or laser guns can only be as accurate as the conditions they are operated under.
The cop is a complete moron for thinking that he can get away with issuing a ticket without evidence, but sadly, too many of them do - even over here in the UK.
The gun has to be stationary to gain an accurate reading as it measures the time that it takes for the beam to be transmitted and reflected back to the device.

If the cop is in a moving vehicle travelling toward you, then the device he is using will measure the combination of his speed and yours.

If a cop following you uses a similar device the speed recorded will be your speed minus his.

The cop knows this, and this is why he told you that he'd erased it - because he didn't use his gun in the first place.

[kristen]

email hockeyman he's a cop!

['94firebirdv6]

thanks for all the advice guys
im a juvenile so i HAVE to go to court.
this has given me a little more confidence tho. from what ive heard the cop rarely shows up to the juvenile court dates because there is only one or two a month with like 30 kids waiting to go in front of the judge. and 99% of them plead guilty or no contest.

unfortunately i was the only other car on the road but it was going around a turn which caused me to further question the speed reading.

should i get a lawyer and fight it because the judge more than likely is not going to believe a 16 y/o over a cop or should i just bend over and take what i get since it is a first time speeding offense?

[MikeV6]

In Ontario, the cop doesn't have to show you the radar gun. It is true in many places, it is just a big common myth that they must show you the radar gun.

Like how insurance will make you pay more for a red car or not cover you if your car is lowered (I drive a red car now and was never asked it's colour by insurance, and I wrote off a lowered car and wasn't even asked about it)

[phil97.3.8]

go to court. if the cop that pulled you over is not in the courtroom it gets thrown out and the ticket is dismissed. Even if he shows which he probably won't, your fine will be reduced and no points.

[camaro_speedemon]

Originally posted by Antman:
Radar or laser guns can only be as accurate as the conditions they are operated under.
The cop is a complete moron for thinking that he can get away with issuing a ticket without evidence, but sadly, too many of them do - even over here in the UK.
The gun has to be stationary to gain an accurate reading as it measures the time that it takes for the beam to be transmitted and reflected back to the device.

If the cop is in a moving vehicle travelling toward you, then the device he is using will measure the combination of his speed and yours.

If a cop following you uses a similar device the speed recorded will be your speed minus his.

The cop knows this, and this is why he told you that he'd erased it - because he didn't use his gun in the first place.

No, they have rolling radar. It figures in the speed of the cruiser.

[57s98Camaro]

Show up, state your case calmly and professionally and see what happens. Remember to dress nice and do all the red tape stuff too. Like others said, if the officer doesn't show up you may get off scot-free.

[Mogobs30th]

Originally posted by camaro_speedemon:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Antman:
Radar or laser guns can only be as accurate as the conditions they are operated under.
The cop is a complete moron for thinking that he can get away with issuing a ticket without evidence, but sadly, too many of them do - even over here in the UK.
The gun has to be stationary to gain an accurate reading as it measures the time that it takes for the beam to be transmitted and reflected back to the device.

If the cop is in a moving vehicle travelling toward you, then the device he is using will measure the combination of his speed and yours.

If a cop following you uses a similar device the speed recorded will be your speed minus his.

The cop knows this, and this is why he told you that he'd erased it - because he didn't use his gun in the first place.

No, they have rolling radar. It figures in the speed of the cruiser. </font>[/QUOTE]I was just about to mention that myself. Most the cruisers here in Indiana are equipped with a rolling radar system, and btw, are part of the car itself. I have never heard of a cop having to show you the gun to see how fast you were going, that is a myth if I have never heard one.