Reasons why front wheel drive sucks

[KBeezy]

I disagree with the "better handling in bad weather conditions" ... My 2wd light *** Sonoma kicks FWD cars asses in "bad weather" ... FWDs are notorious for sliding and MAD under-steer in snow/ice [img]tongue.gif[/img] RWDs are known for over-steer, but over-steer is MUCH easier to correct than under-steer [img]tongue.gif[/img]

[3.4 slow to go]

for all those crying & hiding behind the fwd "lacks on hard launches", I have two words for you: air bag.

Air bag + engine weight over tires for better hard launching = traction rwd creams itself for.


Deal w/it.

[00firebird]

my friend has a civic with a bunch of bolt ons.. he claims its like a 15 second car even though hes never tested it. he wants to bet me 100 before racing me though..

[nikon]

Originally posted by 3.4 slow to go:
for all those crying & hiding behind the fwd "lacks on hard launches", I have two words for you: air bag.

Air bag + engine weight over tires for better hard launching = traction rwd creams itself for.


Deal w/it.

It's obvious you've never been in any sort of physics class.

[3.4 slow to go]

It's obvious that you have very limited fwd experiance

[BirdOfPrey01]

Originally posted by KBeezy:
I disagree with the "better handling in bad weather conditions" ... My 2wd light *** Sonoma kicks FWD cars asses in "bad weather" ... FWDs are notorious for sliding and MAD under-steer in snow/ice [img]tongue.gif[/img] RWDs are known for over-steer, but over-steer is MUCH easier to correct than under-steer [img]tongue.gif[/img]

Lets see you take a corner doing 25+ in the snow [img]smile.gif[/img]

[Brett Garret]

3.4 slow I have to disagree. Under WOT the weight transfers to the rear (as you know). Air bags help a TON for the launch but doesn't 'cure' weight transfer. Yeah it might have better traction but thats simply because all the load is not present. I am not putting down your statement, simply posting a valid reason why FWD is not better on the launch. Why don't dragsters use FWD if they get better traction off the line?

[BirdOfPrey01]

It's obvious that anyone who thinks FWD works with drag racing is a moron. It is just delt with because no other options are avaliable for the type of cars people are modifying.

First of all, modifying a 120 horsepower FWD economy daily driver point A to Point B car is totally a waste of money. Bolt-on's to N/A 4 cylinder car are a huge waste of time and money, anyone want to argue that? How much power can you possible summon from bolting on headers/exhuast/intake upgrades on a 1.6 - 2.4 litre 120-150 horsepower economy engine?

Seriously, if you can gain 50 horsepower, thats great, but for the price you pay is it worth it? A car that weighs 2300 pounds and makes 200 horsepower will still be slow. Your not going to make 13's even low 14's anytime soon thats for sure.

And another note for FWD debate...

I gaurentee that just about 99.999 percent of all Grand Prix GTP owners that modified their car for race, they all wish their car was a RWD platform.
If you can argue that on a performance/race subject, be my guest, be my guest put your bullsh*t to the test [img]smile.gif[/img]

[3.4 slow to go]

I call [img]graemlins/bs.gif[/img] on that poll, probably more like 89% [img]tongue.gif[/img] , and 0% when they still drive the in the snow. Inclamite weather performance for ya. Yup, the air bags aren't a cure, but they sure do help.

It is funny seeing all these people get their panties in a bunch, even over a mighty Yugo [img]graemlins/rofl.gif[/img]

[camaro_speedemon]

So much mis information going on in this thread [img]graemlins/rofl.gif[/img]

I don't feel like quoting everyone, so here it goes.

First off, FWD don't have 'poor weight distribution' My friends civic was 55:45 As is my Matrix.

Secondly, Understeer is a lot easier to correct then over steer. To correct overstear, you must clutch in, countersteer, oops too much, countersteer again.

To correct understeer, clutch in, let off gas. The weight will transfer back to the front wheels and you have traction again. Why do you think most cars are set up to understeer before oversteer ;) understeering is safer.

Thirdly, torque steer is virtually non existant in cars with equal length half-shafts.

[camaro_speedemon]

Originally posted by BirdOfPrey01:
It's obvious that anyone who thinks FWD works with drag racing is a moron. It is just delt with because no other options are avaliable for the type of cars people are modifying.

First of all, modifying a 120 horsepower FWD economy daily driver point A to Point B car is totally a waste of money. Bolt-on's to N/A 4 cylinder car are a huge waste of time and money, anyone want to argue that? How much power can you possible summon from bolting on headers/exhuast/intake upgrades on a 1.6 - 2.4 litre 120-150 horsepower economy engine?

Seriously, if you can gain 50 horsepower, thats great, but for the price you pay is it worth it? A car that weighs 2300 pounds and makes 200 horsepower will still be slow. Your not going to make 13's even low 14's anytime soon thats for sure.

And another note for FWD debate...

I gaurentee that just about 99.999 percent of all Grand Prix GTP owners that modified their car for race, they all wish their car was a RWD platform.
If you can argue that on a performance/race subject, be my guest, be my guest put your bullsh*t to the test [img]smile.gif[/img]

I want to quote this post specificlly. 200HP in a 2300lb car WILL MOST CERTAINLY NOT be slow. SRT4's are perfect examples of this, they have 220HP in a 2800lb car and do low 14's stock w/ an average driver. A 2300 lbs with 200HP will actually do low 13's

http://robrobinette.com/et.htm

Why waste time and money into modding a V6 Fbody? Sure, you might end up with a 12 second car, but after how much money? In the end, you could do a H/C swap on a Z28 and do 11's. Not down playing you guys here, you just have no right to use the logic on "its a waste to modify a Honda" as essentially you're doing the same thing. Face it V6 fbody's aren't performance cars. They exist soley for people who want the look of a performance car, without the performance.

[RedFrk13]

How can you guys put down FWD when you are not even comparing to the times your 3800 FWD conterparts are putting down. There are 4 or 5 Grand Prixs in the 10s and I dont even know how many in the 11s. Yes, rwd will be able to launch better in the end, but they have you beat there too. 12secv6 is the only one competing with their launches. [img]tongue.gif[/img]

[KBeezy]

Originally posted by BirdOfPrey01:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by KBeezy:
I disagree with the "better handling in bad weather conditions" ... My 2wd light *** Sonoma kicks FWD cars asses in "bad weather" ... FWDs are notorious for sliding and MAD under-steer in snow/ice [img]tongue.gif[/img] RWDs are known for over-steer, but over-steer is MUCH easier to correct than under-steer [img]tongue.gif[/img]

Lets see you take a corner doing 25+ in the snow [img]smile.gif[/img] </font>[/QUOTE]Not a problem, its called vehicle control [img]smile.gif[/img] Do it all the time in the parking lot at work [img]graemlins/burnout.gif[/img] Besides, who does take corners at 25+ in the snow? FWD, AWD, 4WD, RWD -- its not a smart thing to do ;)

[ January 17, 2005, 10:43 AM: Message edited by: KBeezy ]

[KBeezy]

"poor weight distribution" -- that wasn't brought up. What WAS brought up was poor weight TRANSFER. Big difference ;)

Understeer is a whole ****LOAD more dangerous if you ask me, maybe its just the fact that I actually know how to actually DRIVE a RWD car. Maybe thats just because I've only owned 1 FWD car in my life so far and that was my 5spd turbo'd probe GT ;)

Torque steer is existant in cars with equal length shafts, it depends on the front suspension setup as well as shaft length [img]smile.gif[/img]

As for 10 second Grand Prixs you're comparing L67s to L36s ;) Factory blown vs Factory NA. Show me L36s running 10s and 11s, haha.


Fact remains, and you cant argue with it. RWD out performs, out handles, is much more reliable, and MUCH more safer than FWD. BUT RWD is a drivers car, FWD is for the masses who just like to point and go if you just ask me ;)


Theres a reason VERY few European cars are FWD ;) Thats one thing I really agree with European manufacturers on, RWD dominates. Theres a reason why theres only 1 front wheel drive Cadillac any more. Theres also a reason why Daimler-Chrysler (Dodge/Chrysler) is going BACK to RWD cars. Same with the rest of GM (since I already mentioned Cadillac) ...


[img]smile.gif[/img]

[nikon]

Originally posted by 3.4 slow to go:
It's obvious that you have very limited fwd experiance

learn to spell, and if you must know I have had my share of FWD experiance :rolleyes: fact is no matter what you do the laws of physics kicks in. weight transfers to the rear. An object in motion wants to stay in motion, object at rest wants to stay at rest. Thus being the reason the front end lunges up in the air when you accelerate. Your back wheels act as a balance point, where all the weight transfers. This putting all the traction at those rear tires. Its the laws of physics deal w/it [img]graemlins/slap.gif[/img]