I was downsized on Thursday.

[Th3 RiCk]

Originally posted by Stefan:
Yes, I have now officially become a statistic. You hear about unemployment in the news but it never really applies until it hits home and slaps you right in the face.

I'm not going to disclose details here... but twenty very talented and well-paid people were laid off on Thursday, rumor has it that there are ten more coming next week. At a company with 150 employees, that's quite a bit.

I did receive a decent severance package which will tide us over for the next two months or so. First thing I did was go to the Virginia Employment Commission and register for unemployment insurance benefits. I get my first check in three weeks. I did qualify for the maximum (point for Virginia) which was $326 a week but that's still not very much--that's $8.15 an hour take-home, equivalent to someone making $10 an hour gross. But it is better than nothing. By my math, if I don't make the same amount I was making ($43,000) by January 1 we'll start to see a slide in our quality of living.

Though I would love to blame the layoff itself on Bush, I really can't. The layoffs were because of overoptimistic sales forecasts that resulted in a $20 million revenue shortfall. Spending was also out of control. It was mindless management--not a bad overall economy--that caused this first round of layoffs.

It is, however, Bush's fault that the unemployment rate in general is this high. I don't doubt that I'll find a new job in the next few weeks but there are a LOT of skilled people out there that are looking for work. I'm competing with people much more talented than I am to get the same pay I was making. Though the layoffs weren't the poor economy's fault, the fact that I will very likely take a pay cut just to get a job again is.

My second major bone to pick is my health insurance. I can keep my current plan for up to 18 months under COBRA laws... but the company is no longer subsidizing it. Now my monthly premium will be going from $15 to $288. I'm f'ing better off going with a private insurance company. So not only have I lost my job but I've lost my insurance and have incurred an additional $150-$200 a month expense.

But according to Bush, nothing's wrong with the American health care system. "The American health care system is the envy of the world." Yeah. Your world. :rolleyes:

If he were here in my apartment (that costs $1,725 a month) I'd ***** slap him.

So I guess I'll just see what happens. There are a lot of positions open on careerbuilder.com and all the other major sites but there is a surplus of supply with workers and a shortage of demand in terms of jobs. I'm being pitted against people with 10+ years more experience than me who are desperate for work so they'll sink to my pay level. So what must I do to compete and actually get a job? Sink to the pay level of a college intern, I suppose.

I don't have my MBA or CPA yet, I can't be picky.

Screw the Bush Administration. I'm sure his corporate CEO buddies are laughing because they can get slaves like me to accept less pay and therefore richen their own fat stock options. But one day I'll be there with them and I'll smack them all down.

Done ranting now. Back to www.careerbuilder.com.

As much as I disagree with your ideas I'm really sorry you lost your job. Good luck in the search!

However, I want to point out a few things. I'll start with the healthcare issue. When Bush says we're the "envy of the world" I would think he is refering to America having the best medicine, doctors, and facilities. Think about it, would your wife had kept her finger if she had been living somewhere else? (You did have a post about her almost losing it right?) Perhaps, but at least here you have many extremely talented medical professionals that get the job done.

Secondly, how could Kerry possibly fix the healthcare system? It only means raising taxes since he's all for the government standing behind us while we piss to make sure we're ok. There is absolutely no possible way free healthcare will be offered in the United States within the next 30-40 years. Honestly, I don't think Bush has any clue how to fix the healthcare system. But neither does Kerry, but he's throwing out ideas to brainwash his followers in believing that he can fix healthcare within the next 4 or even 8 years. In the words of Ross Perot, "Not gonna happen, nu huh."

Thirdly, you defended the minimum wage being raised by 20%. Your job just laid you off because they couldn't afford to pay you. What makes you think that by raising wages they can afford to pay you even more? This really doesn't apply to you since you did make more than min wage. But apply it to the small businesses which are like 80 something % of the economy. You're multi million dollar company is failing. The small businesses aren't going to be booming either. How can they afford to raise wages then? They can't. People will be laid off and the remaining will be asked to do more work thus poorer quality of work. I know this first hand living in Ap. Southern Ohio. I do the work of two people for slightly more than min wage because the restaurant cannot afford to pay two people min wage. So I get 7 bucks an hour to slave away and do twice the work.

Your last words just sum up your hatred for Bush. If you disagree with his policies and actions that's fine. But you blame your life problems on him. Stop filling peoples head with mindless garbage that has no factual basis.

[navyblue2000]

I'm sorry to hear about your job loss Stefan....
If only A and S Computers would have gotten that bid on the refurbs... ;) jk (who got that anyway?)


anyhow, you seem to be a pretty resilient guy, despite the fact that we don't see eye to eye and sometimes my opinion is inferior. But that's not important. Stefan, hope you find something good out there. You will, I'm sure. AND, I'm sure that it won't matter which man gets into office, you'll find a good paying job.

[MTMike]

That really sucks man... good luck in the hunt.

I'm blessed that I'm in a job that I am, making OK money ($30k), especially for my area, but I have great benefits, plus tons of fringe benefits and awesome security.

I cannot even believe that your RENT is 2.5X as much as my mortgage!! That blows my mind...

Take COBRA - Private insurance SUCKS - awful coverage, more than cobra ususally. You will not find private insurance with similar coverage for cheaper than you'll pay with cobra.

The Healthcare system in this country is a joke. The simple fact that some corporation PROFITED on saving my wife's life from cancer over the course of the last year makes me nothing short of sick to my stomach. The fact that that same corporation collected over $110,000 from my insurance company, granted me $4,000 in "assistance" for my share of what the ins. company hadn't paid, and sent our remaining balance of $500 to collections 3 days later further fuels my disgust.

At any rate, good luck in finding a new job..

-Mike

[Loochy88]

Thats awful news! And wow, thats one expensive rent! Makes me appreciate my 200 dollar half of the rent for my college apartment all the more. Good luck finding a job.

[L32Projekt]

Originally posted by majeskyb:
Wow. I'm sorry man. That really sucks. I'm sure you'll be able to find a job in time. If not, you could always join us in the air force! [img]tongue.gif[/img]

Beat me to it, of course this offer only applies if you think you got the brass spheres to pilot a desk with the best!!! ;)

Sorry to hear about your current position. Hope you can find a new job shortly.

[imported_admin]

Originally posted by Th3 RiCk:
As much as I disagree with your ideas I'm really sorry you lost your job. Good luck in the search!

Thank you. [img]smile.gif[/img]

Originally posted by Th3 RiCk:
When Bush says we're the "envy of the world" I would think he is refering to America having the best medicine, doctors, and facilities.

But that's where Bush is wrong. This country does not have the best medicine, doctors, and facilities. Per capita, the USA ranks dead last among developed countries in physician-to-population ratios. Britian, Canada, France, Germany, Sweden, Switzerland, Denmark, and just about every other Western European country has better doctors, more doctors, shorter waiting lists for surgeries, more medicine available (the FDA takes on average 12 years to approve a new drug)... People take shots at Bush on this issue because he is ignorant--he's stuck in this "America is best" mindset, which, when it comes to health care, is just flat out wrong.

Originally posted by Th3 RiCk:
Think about it, would your wife had kept her finger if she had been living somewhere else? (You did have a post about her almost losing it right?) Perhaps, but at least here you have many extremely talented medical professionals that get the job done.

Yes, she would have had the same tendon reconstructive surgery had we lived in any other developed nation, and our out-of-pocket cost would have been $0 instead of the $2000 we ended up coughing up among copays, 80/20, non-insurance-coverage of physical therapy, etc.

Originally posted by Th3 RiCk:
Secondly, how could Kerry possibly fix the healthcare system? It only means raising taxes since he's all for the government standing behind us while we piss to make sure we're ok.

As election analysts predicted, Bush is using the strategy of attempting to paint the picture that Kerry is a free-spending liberal who will raise everyone's taxes. That is not true. Its called a reallocation of resources. Imagine how terrific the U.S. health care system could be if the hundreds of billions of dollars that Bush has spent on "homeland security" was spent on programs that actually benefit Americans instead?

Originally posted by Th3 RiCk:
Thirdly, you defended the minimum wage being raised by 20%. Your job just laid you off because they couldn't afford to pay you. What makes you think that by raising wages they can afford to pay you even more? This really doesn't apply to you since you did make more than min wage.

Correct. I made 4-5 times minimum wage plus benefits. All companies can afford a 20% increase in wages for their workers at the bottom. If they cannot, it only speeds up the inevitable--that the business will go under. If they're that weak, good riddance. Nine out of ten businesses fail and that's why our economy (pre-Bush) was the envy of the world. We had strong companies running the show, not weak penny-pinchers.

Originally posted by Th3 RiCk:
But apply it to the small businesses which are like 80 something % of the economy.

Distorted statistic. True, around 80% of companies in this country are sole proprietorships or partnerships. But corporations, that small 20% minority, make up 90% of revenues. As much as the American small business owner is celebrated, his effect on the economy is very small. Multimillion dollar corporations rule this economy--and they can easily afford the 20% increase in minimum wage.

Originally posted by Th3 RiCk:
You're multi million dollar company is failing.

Yes, because of stupid management, not because of increased costs. I could tell some stories... oh hell, I'll share one. This spring the company paid half a million dollars to bring some consultants onboard to "coach" my department and show us how to do our jobs the "right" way. They hung out for three months, had the blessing of management, the resentment of the employees, and then disappeared. Where did all of their fancy flowcharts and PowerPoint presentations end up? In a binder, collecting dust, on a VP's bookshelf. I could go on and on but I don't need to. Increased labor costs is NOT what caused those layoffs.

Originally posted by Th3 RiCk:
The small businesses aren't going to be booming either. How can they afford to raise wages then? They can't.

Yes they can. Right now, the real brunt of skyrocketing health care costs are felt by small businesses who must provide insurance to their employees. If Kerry wins and reforms the health care system those costs will be controlled. This will result in plenty of money left over for companies to pay their employees more and/or increase net earnings--depending on how many minimum wage employees they maintain.

Besides, companies can always afford to raise the wages of their workers at the bottom--the question is do they want to. Sad fact: in America, employers do not view the toiling worker at the bottom as much more than a slave. Contrary to what that motivational poster in the break room suggests, your hard work is not appreciated.

If they try to tell you to work twice as hard because they can't afford to hire another person they're lying. Of course they're going to overwork you as much as humanly possible. Watch your boss tell you he can't afford to hire another person for prison wages as he goes home for the day in his Mercedes.

[ October 17, 2004, 09:42 AM: Message edited by: Stefan ]

[Johnny Ray]

I wish you the best Stefan.

I know through the years of the tough times I have had built me into the character that I am today my friend.

Uncertainity from the outside brought focus, certainity, determination and faith in myself on the inside.

I beleive that you have the same qualities within you.

:cool:

[chas]

well my company is currently looking for people. visit http://sh.webhire.com/Public/591/AES.htm

i dont know your technical background. your previous descriptions of your job sounded a bit like contract administration or financial analyst.

yes, we are a government contractor for the military. if that bothers you this is not the job for you. i just like to think of it as paying myself to work.

[Camarorulz]

I sympathize with your situation Stefan and I hope you find a job real soon.

I do however disagree with some of your points. It's just as ridiculous claiming Bush is responsible for any economic downturn as saying Clinton was responsible for the boom. Clinton just happened to be on top when it was good. The government dumping a bunch of money into the economy will not boost it: the government cutting taxes (as Bush has done) so CONSUMERS can spend more WILL boost the economy. I've said it before and I'll say it again, the government cannot and WILL NOT spend my money more wisely than I can.

[Th3 RiCk]

But that's where Bush is wrong. This country does not have the best medicine, doctors, and facilities. Per capita, the USA ranks dead last among developed countries in physician-to-population ratios. Britian, Canada, France, Germany, Sweden, Switzerland, Denmark, and just about every other Western European country has better doctors, more doctors, shorter waiting lists for surgeries, more medicine available (the FDA takes on average 12 years to approve a new drug)... People take shots at Bush on this issue because he is ignorant--he's stuck in this "America is best" mindset, which, when it comes to health care, is just flat out wrong.

Of course these countries are going to have better physician to patient ratio. America has nearly 40 million more people than all those countries combined. There simply aren't enough people interested in the medical field.

As far as technology we by far lead the world in medical field. Take Canada for instance. They have 11 heart facilities. That's 1 for every 2.3 million people. In America we have nearly 800. 1 for every 800,000. I think I read somewhere where Sweden had a total of 2 CAT scans in the entire country. Some states alone have 4x that amount.

I'm not sure about some of the countries you listed by I know for sure that with Canada and GB you do not make the choice on your treatment. Neither does your doctor for that matter. Decisions are made by the gov't to how you will be treated. Would you want that? That's why these countries have loop holes in the system to allow patients to look for treatment outside of their countries. Doctors and people alike are fleeing to America for treatment because they have options.

Yes they can. Right now, the real brunt of skyrocketing health care costs are felt by small businesses who must provide insurance to their employees. If Kerry wins and reforms the health care system those costs will be controlled. This will result in plenty of money left over for companies to pay their employees more and/or increase net earnings--depending on how many minimum wage employees they maintain.

Besides, companies can always afford to raise the wages of their workers at the bottom--the question is do they want to. Sad fact: in America, employers do not view the toiling worker at the bottom as much more than a slave. Contrary to what that motivational poster in the break room suggests, your hard work is not appreciated.

If they try to tell you to work twice as hard because they can't afford to hire another person they're lying. Of course they're going to overwork you as much as humanly possible. Watch your boss tell you he can't afford to hire another person for prison wages as he goes home for the day in his Mercedes.

You have a good point, but look at it from this position. You are the owner of a restaurant. You portion money that you allow your managers to spend. 30% wages, 30% food, 20% alcohol, 10% goes to accounts payable, the last 10% goes into your pocket. Now if wages are raised you must compensate by raising the percent of money you portioned for wages. Do you take a pay cut or dip into the food and alcohol %? Now there's poorer quality food. The consumer which is also your worker is making more money but spending more money on food. We're back at the same point. People are greedy and want the highest possible profit.
Now you say that if healthcare is reformed the small businesses will have a ton of extra money left over that they can give to the little guy. Will the little guy see the money? No, the head honcho will build a new tennis court for his 3rd home at the beach. It's sad, but it's the way the world works. People are greedy. It's only a lose/lose situation for the bottom half of the totem pole.

On the other hand, if wages are raised and healthcare can turn itself around then that would be awesome. Both sides would be happy. But I don't think it's even possible within the next 20+ years to see a big change in healthcare. We've already let this snow ball for years and years and it's going to take more than a few years to fix itself.

[ October 17, 2004, 12:48 PM: Message edited by: Th3 RiCk ]

[Th3 RiCk]

Originally posted by Camarorulz:
I sympathize with your situation Stefan and I hope you find a job real soon.

I do however disagree with some of your points. It's just as ridiculous claiming Bush is responsible for any economic downturn as saying Clinton was responsible for the boom. Clinton just happened to be on top when it was good. The government dumping a bunch of money into the economy will not boost it: the government cutting taxes (as Bush has done) so CONSUMERS can spend more WILL boost the economy. I've said it before and I'll say it again, the government cannot and WILL NOT spend my money more wisely than I can.

"The government dumping a bunch of money into the economy will not boost it: the government cutting taxes (as Bush has done) so CONSUMERS can spend more WILL boost the economy."

What makes you think that? Sure I agree with the second half, but if the gov't spends money the economy will be stimulated. How do you think America emerged from the Great Depression? WW2 came along thats how. The gov't was forced to spend a buttload of money and the economy rose from the depths of hell.

[HAZ-Matt]

Originally posted by Th3 RiCk:
Of course these countries are going to have better physician to patient ratio. America has nearly 40 million more people than all those countries combined. There simply aren't enough people interested in the medical field.

It's not that people aren't necessarily interested. In 2003 there were 34,786 applicants for 17,539 spots. The schools limit the number of physicians, and that is a good thing. EDIT: Not to mention the number of people that take the MCAT each year... which is substantially higher than 35,000. There is self selection even before application.

As far as technology we by far lead the world in medical field. Take Canada for instance. They have 11 heart facilities. That's 1 for every 2.3 million people. In America we have nearly 800. 1 for every 800,000. I think I read somewhere where Sweden had a total of 2 CAT scans in the entire country. Some states alone have 4x that amount.

That number of 2CT's in all of Sweden is pretty shocking. It sounds like an old number really. I'm not sure how many we have on campus, but it is more than 2.

You have a good point, but look at it from this position. You are the owner of a restaurant. You portion money that you allow your managers to spend. 30% wages, 30% food, 20% alcohol, 10% goes to accounts payable, the last 10% goes into your pocket. Now if wages are raised you must compensate by raising the percent of money you portioned for wages. Do you take a pay cut or dip into the food and alcohol %? Now there's poorer quality food. The consumer which is also your worker is making more money but spending more money on food. We're back at the same point. People are greedy and want the highest possible profit.

A smart business owner will reduce "profit" number because essentially that isn't a budgeted number, and you can get back the same profits is you improve service and increase revenue.

Now you say that if healthcare is reformed the small businesses will have a ton of extra money left over that they can give to the little guy. Will the little guy see the money? No, the head honcho will build a new tennis court for his 3rd home at the beach. It's sad, but it's the way the world works. People are greedy. It's only a lose/lose situation for the bottom half of the totem pole.

That argument also was related to increasing minimum wage... so if the wage was increased will teh healthcare costs were removed, yes the little guy would obviously see it.

On the other hand, if wages are raised and healthcare can turn itself around then that would be awesome. Both sides would be happy. But I don't think it's even possible within the next 20+ years to see a big change in healthcare. We've already let this snow ball for years and years and it's going to take more than a few years to fix itself.

It would take only a few years to make healthcare accessible to everyone if policy makers were so inclined. There really isn't anything to fix besides the insurance and payment side.

[ October 17, 2004, 03:29 PM: Message edited by: HAZ-Matt ]

[HAZ-Matt]

Originally posted by Th3 RiCk:
What makes you think that? Sure I agree with the second half, but if the gov't spends money the economy will be stimulated. How do you think America emerged from the Great Depression? WW2 came along thats how. The gov't was forced to spend a buttload of money and the economy rose from the depths of hell.

If you'll notice, the governement was spending money in such a way that the money was getting into the hands of the masses, which could then consume goods. In fact, the economy was picking up before WWII started. In this situation, you have tax cuts for the wealthy, and defense spending, and record profits for the oil industry; all of which is doing nothing more but concentrating money in the hands of a few stockholders. Trickle down has never and will never work. If you are going to spend during a recession, you must be Keynesian and put the money in the pockets of as many people as possible.

[Snuffalofogus]

Originally posted by Stefan:
Yes, I have now officially become a statistic. You hear about unemployment in the news but it never really applies until it hits home and slaps you right in the face.

I'm not going to disclose details here... but twenty very talented and well-paid people were laid off on Thursday, rumor has it that there are ten more coming next week. At a company with 150 employees, that's quite a bit.

I did receive a decent severance package which will tide us over for the next two months or so. First thing I did was go to the Virginia Employment Commission and register for unemployment insurance benefits. I get my first check in three weeks. I did qualify for the maximum (point for Virginia) which was $326 a week but that's still not very much--that's $8.15 an hour take-home, equivalent to someone making $10 an hour gross. But it is better than nothing. By my math, if I don't make the same amount I was making ($43,000) by January 1 we'll start to see a slide in our quality of living.

Though I would love to blame the layoff itself on Bush, I really can't. The layoffs were because of overoptimistic sales forecasts that resulted in a $20 million revenue shortfall. Spending was also out of control. It was mindless management--not a bad overall economy--that caused this first round of layoffs.

It is, however, Bush's fault that the unemployment rate in general is this high. I don't doubt that I'll find a new job in the next few weeks but there are a LOT of skilled people out there that are looking for work. I'm competing with people much more talented than I am to get the same pay I was making. Though the layoffs weren't the poor economy's fault, the fact that I will very likely take a pay cut just to get a job again is.

My second major bone to pick is my health insurance. I can keep my current plan for up to 18 months under COBRA laws... but the company is no longer subsidizing it. Now my monthly premium will be going from $15 to $288. I'm f'ing better off going with a private insurance company. So not only have I lost my job but I've lost my insurance and have incurred an additional $150-$200 a month expense.

But according to Bush, nothing's wrong with the American health care system. "The American health care system is the envy of the world." Yeah. Your world. :rolleyes:

If he were here in my apartment (that costs $1,725 a month) I'd ***** slap him.

So I guess I'll just see what happens. There are a lot of positions open on careerbuilder.com and all the other major sites but there is a surplus of supply with workers and a shortage of demand in terms of jobs. I'm being pitted against people with 10+ years more experience than me who are desperate for work so they'll sink to my pay level. So what must I do to compete and actually get a job? Sink to the pay level of a college intern, I suppose.

I don't have my MBA or CPA yet, I can't be picky.

Screw the Bush Administration. I'm sure his corporate CEO buddies are laughing because they can get slaves like me to accept less pay and therefore richen their own fat stock options. But one day I'll be there with them and I'll smack them all down.

Done ranting now. Back to www.careerbuilder.com.

sucks you were laid off, but instead of *****ing about it, you should be focusing on getting another job.

quit blaming others for your problems.

[phoenix64]

"sucks you were laid off, but instead of *****ing about it, you should be focusing on getting another job.

quit blaming others for your problems."

Did you honestly belevie that when you said it or were you just trying to be an *******? I'm really curious.