September 11th fatique

[V6Bob]

I don't want to mess up the other thread, and something needs to be said here.

"Can we just walk away now? NO. (see post WWI Germany for reasons)"

"when he got back he told me so many stories that just pumped me up even more to keep troops over there"

"we're stuck there now and we cant leave until the country is stable"

"we CANNOT leave and probably will not for along time. All you can do is support until it's stable."

I know that 30% of the American people still support the war. Maybe most of the people here.

But the reality is we will start major troop reductions in the next year, aimed at total withdrawal.

The Republicans in Congress will revolt before that. They can do the math. You can't continue a war that's supported by only 30% of the American people, almost all of them your core voters anyway. It's political suicide.

So, the responsible thing for Bush to do is to sit down with the military and the State Department (and the Democrat leaders) and figure out what's the best strategy to pursue in Iraq assuming we're going to leave in the next few years, no matter what.

When we do leave Iraq it will be horrible, no matter what or when. The thing we need to figure out is how to make it less horrible. My personal favorite is three countries. We guarantee the security of the Kurds, Saudi Arabia does the same for the Sunnis, and Iran, the Shiites. Terrorists will be worse off with that setup than they are now.

[josh98bird]

Re: September 11th fatique

I only see an arguement occuring from this thread... Many agree and some disagree. Some will say it would have happened this way and some would say it wouldn't have. Either way we are over there and need to take care of business. There is no reason to leave it in a mess that we caused, even if it was doomed in the first place.

[crushedout]

Re: September 11th fatique

DAISEY CUTTERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[FirebirdGT]

Re: September 11th fatique

So, the responsible thing for Bush to do is to sit down with the military and the State Department (and the Democrat leaders) and figure out what's the best strategy to pursue in Iraq assuming we're going to leave in the next few years, no matter what.

CNN 12:45 PDT

President Bush will announce this week plans to cut U.S. troop numbers in Iraq by about 30,000 by next summer, The Associated Press reports quoting unnamed officials.

[3.4 slow to go]

Re: September 11th fatique

DAISEY CUTTERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

those aren't the big ones anymore, welcome to the MOAB
http://www.globalsecurity.org/milita...tions/moab.htm

[SpeedingFirebird]

Re: September 11th fatique

The Republicans in Congress will revolt before that. They can do the math. You can't continue a war that's supported by only 30% of the American people, almost all of them your core voters anyway. It's political suicide.

Sadly, you are right. it is too bad politics will affect this outcome instead of doing what needs to be done (whatever that may be).

So, the responsible thing for Bush to do is to sit down with the military and the State Department (and the Democrat leaders) and figure out what's the best strategy to pursue in Iraq assuming we're going to leave in the next few years, no matter what.

Haven't they tried this? The "problem" is that one side wants a full scale unconditional pull-out and the other doesn't want egg on their collective faces. Again politics.

When we do leave Iraq it will be horrible, no matter what or when. The thing we need to figure out is how to make it less horrible.

This is a hard metric. Less horrible for whom? Some things I read Iraquis say things are better now. Some say worse.

Either way we are over there and need to take care of business. There is no reason to leave it in a mess that we caused, even if it was doomed in the first place.

agreed.

[V6Bob]

Re: September 11th fatique

Originally Posted by V6Bob
"So, the responsible thing for Bush to do is to sit down with the military and the State Department (and the Democrat leaders) and figure out what's the best strategy to pursue in Iraq assuming we're going to leave in the next few years, no matter what."

Haven't they tried this? The "problem" is that one side wants a full scale unconditional pull-out and the other doesn't want egg on their collective faces. Again politics.

No they haven't, at all. Bush has been "determined".

I'm not talking about what's "best". My point is people who say "We'll be there for several years" are ignoring political reality. We won't and we need to plan for that, starting right now. What's the best thing we can do in, say, two years? Out by Fall, 2009. The Democrats would be happy to have that discussion, but Bush won't entertain the notion.

[SpeedingFirebird]

Re: September 11th fatique

No they haven't, at all. Bush has been "determined".

I'm not talking about what's "best". My point is people who say "We'll be there for several years" are ignoring political reality. We won't and we need to plan for that, starting right now. What's the best thing we can do in, say, two years? Out by Fall, 2009. The Democrats would be happy to have that discussion, but Bush won't entertain the notion.

I *think* the issue there is you cannot set an absolute date. The terrorists will go into hiding, train more, build forces, and then return winter of 2009.

[mloaks]

Re: September 11th fatique

those aren't the big ones anymore, welcome to the MOAB
http://www.globalsecurity.org/milita...tions/moab.htm

The Russians just tested a bigger one even yet, with tact nuke power!:eek: