Will you buy gas at $5????

[Firebirdkid96]

Re: Will you buy gas at $5????

The flaw in your logic is you base it on the foundation that oil companies set the prices. They are one part of a complex formula.

The "cycle" you describe is called inflation. It is not a new concept, and it will not be the demise of our economy.

Realistically, this is what will happen. Crude oil will reach a price point where people will cut consumption. Money will flow into alternate energy sources (e.g. people will invest in solar power for their houses). The price of oil will start to fall based on decreased demand. The price will eventually stabilize again.

As long as demand remains the same, the price will keep going up. This system is working as designed.

While you are right regarding the oil companies being one part of a complex formula, the variable is that they are currently the largest part of the formula.

you're right. That's inflation, but, while inflation does follow a similar procedure, it typically doesn't result in the value of the american dollar dropping to almost being worthless in other countries.

the problem here is that people will not cut consumption, because they have no way to. There are not enough mass transit systems for suburban areas, people are NOT going to ride their bike to work when their DRIVE is already 45 minutes, and they are not just going to up and change to a closer job. And as far as money flowing into alternative energy sources, there still aren't any out there that are as affordable as oil. You speak of solar power. To run my home strictly off solar power, it would take a system costing roughly $34,000, and that is only with a 4kw system. as far alternatives fuels in gas, yes they're working on it, but even with GM's E-Flex platform being unveiled it won't be availible for production until 2016 as a preliminary estimate. All other forms of alternative energy have either had the patents bought out, or are not cost effective. The system for inflation works because after a certain period of time, demand tapers off and supply and demand fall equal again and therefore prices become steady. However at this point in time, the likelyhood of demand following the a-typical curve of standard inflation formulae is extraordinarily low. Demand will stay high because of the dependency on the product at hand, and prices will continue to rise. This is not typical inflation.

The system is working as designed, yes, but the design of the system is not working for the economy.

Like i said, just my opinion.

[Niko97RS]

Re: Will you buy gas at $5????

there is no gas shortage and gas should be $2.50 a gallon and this is why...

2 years ago...mobil made a $15 BILLION profit the first QUARTER

last year...mobil made a $50 BILLION profit th FIRST QUARTER....oil is the ONLY good/service in the US where when the price goes up...the profit goes up more...

it doesnt follow any of the theories of supply and demand. FUCCKKKK BUSH and FUCCKKK everything he stands for. hes bent this country over backwards so he can make bankk

[SpeedingFirebird]

Re: Will you buy gas at $5????

While you are right regarding the oil companies being one part of a complex formula, the variable is that they are currently the largest part of the formula.

you're right. That's inflation, but, while inflation does follow a similar procedure, it typically doesn't result in the value of the american dollar dropping to almost being worthless in other countries.

That's exactly what inflation does if not left in check.

the problem here is that people will not cut consumption, because they have no way to. There are not enough mass transit systems for suburban areas, people are NOT going to ride their bike to work when their DRIVE is already 45 minutes, and they are not just going to up and change to a closer job. And as far as money flowing into alternative energy sources, there still aren't any out there that are as affordable as oil. You speak of solar power. To run my home strictly off solar power, it would take a system costing roughly $34,000, and that is only with a 4kw system. as far alternatives fuels in gas, yes they're working on it, but even with GM's E-Flex platform being unveiled it won't be availible for production until 2016 as a preliminary estimate. All other forms of alternative energy have either had the patents bought out, or are not cost effective.

25 years ago there was a big shift away from huge cars to smaller ones. We have yet to see that shift again. I would count the number of SUVs in my parking lot, but a giant excursion driven by a single person is blocking my view. Consumption CAN be cut significantly. Solar power tech is getting cheaper. And as demand increases for those technologies, it should help bring the price down (amortized costs). True, we do not have the infrastructure for large public transportation, but their are choices people can make - not driving excursions to work, car pooling, WAH one day a week, etc. Until people start making better choices, the price will not change. High gas prices are already spurring much research in alternate fuels, and it is a matter of time before they become cost effective. Necessity breeds invention. Your doomsday scenario will not play out.

The system for inflation works because after a certain period of time, demand tapers off and supply and demand fall equal again and therefore prices become steady. However at this point in time, the likelyhood of demand following the a-typical curve of standard inflation formulae is extraordinarily low. Demand will stay high because of the dependency on the product at hand, and prices will continue to rise. This is not typical inflation.

Dependency will wain if the price goes too high. See my previous paragraph.

The system is working as designed, yes, but the design of the system is not working for the economy.

The system IS our economy. It will eventually balance.

Like i said, just my opinion.

No worries Bro. Just having an intelligent conversation.

it doesnt follow any of the theories of supply and demand.

Actually, it does.

FUCCKKKK BUSH and FUCCKKK everything he stands for. hes bent this country over backwards so he can make bankk

:rolleyes:

[Firebirdkid96]

Re: Will you buy gas at $5????

I think you and I should try to develop a solution to this gas problem.

anyone know where we can get unused hydrocarbons?

[DAS BOOT]

Re: Will you buy gas at $5????

there is no gas shortage and gas should be $2.50 a gallon and this is why...

2 years ago...mobil made a $15 BILLION profit the first QUARTER

last year...mobil made a $50 BILLION profit th FIRST QUARTER....oil is the ONLY good/service in the US where when the price goes up...the profit goes up more...

it doesnt follow any of the theories of supply and demand. FUCCKKKK BUSH and FUCCKKK everything he stands for. hes bent this country over backwards so he can make bankk

how the **** is this Bush's fault? When did he start controling the oil companies. Now he has a weather machine that causes Hurricanes, and controls the oil companies and turned our government into a dictatorship and single handedly runs our military and every facet of our daily lives!?!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!??!? !?!?!?!

yet the average american will call him a dumbass that has no clue what he is doing.

I am not a Bush nutswinger I just wonder if people know how dumb they sound when they associate every problem with Bush. I guess its true though... The output shaft on my tranny did break when bush was in office, same with the spun bearing in my motor. This didn't happen when Clinton was in power.




As for not being able to reduce our consumption. I was basically in charge of making my location "more green" as our company is trying to company wide.

At first I said, its a bunch of tree hugging hippy ****. But you know what, I cut our power bill by ~$2,000-3,000 a month.(normally around $14,000-17,000 a month)

All I did... just tell peopel to ****ing shut lights off and not leave them on 24/7 365. Set the after hour ACs to 80* instead of 78*. Even with people only listening maybe 70% of the time we cut that much. Also did things liek make sure the exit doors seal decently and no obvious gapps in the doors.

On top of that we are now going to get couple Thousand rebate with teh power company.




This is just simple stuff people do at home and not at work I noticed. Think if every company everywehre was able to save 1/3rd of that. We see ti works so much in the not so often used large storage rooms they are going to motion sensor lights.




And like I said earlier(not sure if it was this board) Just by re arranging my driving and planning my trips better. I still accomplish the same tasks, no real inconvience to myself, but now I use 1 less tank of gas a month. I went from 3 tanks, down to 2 tanks(of average driving) 33% decrease.

[steddy]

Re: Will you buy gas at $5????

I'm gonna trade the Bone for a motorcycle.

Got one of those and it's still pricey at the pump. $8 to top it off, when it used to be $2. I don't know if we'll be as lucky as we were in the mid '70's when gas sky-rocketed to $1.50/gal. There may be no end to this one. I hear the "big 3" are posting record losses and the oil companies are posting record profits. Hmm, well, I guess if your product increased it's price by about 400% in the span of 6 years, you could have record profits.

[Bonemaro]

Re: Will you buy gas at $5????

I don't know if we'll be as lucky as we were in the mid '70's when gas sky-rocketed to $1.50/gal.

I wouldn't call that lucky. $1.50 in 1972 is over $7.60 today.

[LETZRIDE]

Re: Will you buy gas at $5????

that's no reason to sit down and take it....

Bone's right. Part of the politics of the rising price of crude oil is because they trying to make a move, they want us to open up more areas that are restricted from drilling. It's a political move on behalf of the oil companies to make movements toward what they want. At the same pace, T-top is right. They want to line their pockets. It's the "american dream". Money. Misconceived dreams of success are making money. That's what they want. greengreengreen. However at the same time, we're involved in a never-ending cycle. This of this. As the price of crude oil increases, the price of living increases. The two go hand in hand, because America relies on crude oil. So as we pay more for gas, and food, and everything else, employers are reluctant to raise wages because if they did, more of their profit margin would go toward human resources, and since the raise of retail pricing is directly influenced by the raise of wholesale pricing, there's no increase in profit margin to offset the wage hike. So we've established why we're not seeing any raises or any extra income. But why do the prices keep going up? as a result of the increase in cost of living, the same people who are making the money now are spending more money. To keep the same profit margin on their product, they have to raise prices, which means our prices raise. So if that cycle keeps going, and we aren't making any money, that mean we have less money to spend on our wants (which make up relatively 70% of our economy, as quoted by AP). If that 70% slows up, the economy slows up until it's completely subsidized, people are buying the bare minimum,and we're paying more and more for products which constantly go up, and more people run out of money, default on loans, etc. The poverty rate increases, until we're back into a "caste system" that we're working so hard to get rid of. In the end, the people who are selling the keystone of the economy (crude oil) wind up with the money, while most people go completely broke and bankrupt. All because of oil and greed. It's a never ending cycle. Until someone does something.

Now i'm no expert, but I firmly believe that based on the logic found in the above paragraph, the social issue with crude oil at the moment could very well bring upon the end of the American era in history. Unless somehow someway we act NOW.

but that's just my 2 cents.

well put....I having been saying this for awhile to...just not exactly the way you put it.

[steddy]

Re: Will you buy gas at $5????

My point was that it then went down and smoothed out. Back in '85, it dropped down to $.50. Those were the days. I don't know if I'd blame Bush totally, but he is receiving a pension from the oil industry that he retired from. Not that he makes it high, but I'm sure it equates to bigger pension checks somehow.

[DAS BOOT]

Re: Will you buy gas at $5????

My point was that it then went down and smoothed out. Back in '85, it dropped down to $.50. Those were the days. I don't know if I'd blame Bush totally, but he is receiving a pension from the oil industry that he retired from. Not that he makes it high, but I'm sure it equates to bigger pension checks somehow.

Any president, even unpopular ones who served 2 terms, do not have to worry about pensions form oil companies they are pretty much set for life comfortably.

[DAS BOOT]

Re: Will you buy gas at $5????

My point was that it then went down and smoothed out. Back in '85, it dropped down to $.50. Those were the days. I don't know if I'd blame Bush totally, but he is receiving a pension from the oil industry that he retired from. Not that he makes it high, but I'm sure it equates to bigger pension checks somehow.

What happened before that?

Big carbed v8 cars disapeared and we were left with 170 hp v8 camaros, introduction of VW rabbits, Crxs, improved fuel injection, computer controled cars and many other more fuel efficient cars.

[FirebirdPhil]

Re: Will you buy gas at $5????

I'm still holding out hope for hydrogen (if it can be better stabilized somehow) and the air compressed car that the French are/were/supposedly/mythically working on. I read about it in Reader's Digest like a year or so ago, and have heard nothing more about it. I asked this a few weeks ago, but has anyone heard an update? This oil situation is really getting kinda hairy. I mean, what if gas does hit $10/g? Now people said 2 years ago that gas would never hit $4/g, but look where we're at. At $10/g can you imagine what this would do to our economy if we're still so dependant on oil?

[Firebirdkid96]

Re: Will you buy gas at $5????

My point was that it then went down and smoothed out. Back in '85, it dropped down to $.50. Those were the days. I don't know if I'd blame Bush totally, but he is receiving a pension from the oil industry that he retired from. Not that he makes it high, but I'm sure it equates to bigger pension checks somehow.

So he's receiving a pension. Wahoo. There are conspiricy theories everywhere.

Bottom line, and what I've been trying to get at in every post since my initial lengthy post is that this is NOT going to fix itself. It's not going to just drop back.

And thank you to all the member's who have agreed with me.

I agree with speeding firebird to an extent as well. He has made some valid points, and I feel that together as a board we are well on track to properly identifying the logic behind the true issues at hand, and I only hope that the visitors (not members) to this site view this thread.

Awareness and consciousness of concern is what get the wheels of innovation moving. Maybe together we can start something, even being just an f-body enthusiast forum.

Thanks to josh for opening this thread.
:tup::tup:


btw, for the record- those emails you receive about not buying gas today. If only there were a way for us to boycott gasoline as efficiently as our forefathers did with british imports in the 18th century we astually could turn this thing around.

[steddy]

Re: Will you buy gas at $5????

Yeah, power went away and it got more and more high tech under the hood, and they keep trying to make rechargeable golf carts look cool, but oil, for the time being is a catch 22. Of course, on the other hand, one man is not controlling it and it's a circular effect. The more we need, the higher it goes, the more we pay. The truly unfortunate thing about it is that with oil's prices, so too follows other things, like food, considering that it will cost more to take to market and those increases are passed to us as well.

[SpeedingFirebird]

Re: Will you buy gas at $5????

how the **** is this Bush's fault? When did he start controling the oil companies. Now he has a weather machine that causes Hurricanes, and controls the oil companies and turned our government into a dictatorship and single handedly runs our military and every facet of our daily lives!?!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!??!? !?!?!?!

yet the average american will call him a dumbass that has no clue what he is doing.

I am not a Bush nutswinger I just wonder if people know how dumb they sound when they associate every problem with Bush. I guess its true though... The output shaft on my tranny did break when bush was in office, same with the spun bearing in my motor. This didn't happen when Clinton was in power.

Well said!

Reminds me of something I read in psych class on why most successful governments have a single (sometimes completely powerless) leader instead of co-leaders or committees. The reason, people want a single person to turn to for guidance and a single person to blame. I can't believe Bush blew my header gasket! Fel-pro is lining his pockets!