what am i doing wrong?

[wishigotan8]

Re: what am i doing wrong?

I dotn mean to start a war but i dissagree, a 2.1 isn't a traction problem..and I disagree with jsut about everyone i saying you need practice,lsd and slicks for your 60'(theres nothing wrong with a 2.1), you just need to hit a day with good air. Dont rev the **** out of your car at the start it wont help, it will jsut heat up your torque converter, if your goign to mess with your launch try jsut givng it a very little amount of gas (1,000-1,200 rpm so there's good response when it goes into WOT) and let the torque converter "flash" to your stall (which stock is very low). I would say the best advice for you to hit a 14 is go to the track alot in the beginning and end of the season when the weather is good and the air is nice and cool...when you stage, TAKE YOUR TIME, roll in very slow the sooner you stop, the more "free track" you get, remember that the timer doenst start untill your front tire leaves the light so by shallow staging you get to be at WOT for about 1 ft before the timer even starts. Try messing with your PSI like stated before i would try running all you tires fully inflated because i dont think your having problems spinning. Also a trick for lowering your 60' and changing your reaction time is to let some air out of one of your front tires...the less air makes the tire flatter=more contact patch and keeps it in the starting line laser longer givng you more "free track." Get to know yoru car...every car has a pattern it follows my V6 camaro always makes it's fastest run after i drive it to the track and its completely warmed up...my race car is opposite its fasted run comes right off the trailer. Also a used nitrous kit isnt worth the 50 bucks you save..get new for new solenoids.

[Turbo V6 Camaro]

Re: what am i doing wrong?

I dotn mean to start a war but i dissagree, a 2.1 isn't a traction problem..and I disagree with jsut about everyone i saying you need practice,lsd and slicks for your 60'(theres nothing wrong with a 2.1), you just need to hit a day with good air. Dont rev the **** out of your car at the start it wont help, it will jsut heat up your torque converter, if your goign to mess with your launch try jsut givng it a very little amount of gas (1,000-1,200 rpm so there's good response when it goes into WOT) and let the torque converter "flash" to your stall (which stock is very low). I would say the best advice for you to hit a 14 is go to the track alot in the beginning and end of the season when the weather is good and the air is nice and cool...when you stage, TAKE YOUR TIME, roll in very slow the sooner you stop, the more "free track" you get, remember that the timer doenst start untill your front tire leaves the light so by shallow staging you get to be at WOT for about 1 ft before the timer even starts. Try messing with your PSI like stated before i would try running all you tires fully inflated because i dont think your having problems spinning. Also a trick for lowering your 60' and changing your reaction time is to let some air out of one of your front tires...the less air makes the tire flatter=more contact patch and keeps it in the starting line laser longer givng you more "free track." Get to know yoru car...every car has a pattern it follows my V6 camaro always makes it's fastest run after i drive it to the track and its completely warmed up...my race car is opposite its fasted run comes right off the trailer. Also a used nitrous kit isnt worth the 50 bucks you save..get new for new solenoids.

:spank:

[wishigotan8]

Re: what am i doing wrong?

ok this is exactly what i wanted to avoid..but whats your problem with it viper?

[Fbody3400]

Re: what am i doing wrong?

I'd probably keep all the air in my front tires....................

[Turbo V6 Camaro]

Re: what am i doing wrong?

ok this is exactly what i wanted to avoid..but whats your problem with it viper?

dont take to hart a word he posted, whers jame's he has to read that

[wishigotan8]

Re: what am i doing wrong?

ok, i think you guys are taking the air out of the one front tire wrong...i dotn mean drop it to the point thats it's flat or even as low as you guys lower your back...im jsut saying that to get that extra little bit you can "cheat" it off your 60' by how you line up in that light and the air in one of the front tires. Now dotn get all steamed, but do any of you guys actually have a clue what you are doing at the race track( i dont mean how fast you can go..anyone can floor a 12 second car and hold on..i mean do you actually know how to race)? Havent you ever seen cars especially in hot rod classes that run abnormally small or big tires(i mean circumfrence wise nto drag skinnies or wide tires) or an altered front wheelbase sometimes those mods are for this reason(the reaction time purpose more so)...if you can't run a delay box you have to work with what you got and that means changing how you leave the line or a throttle stop if its legal( ts's are air regulated and dotn allow you to go to WOT instantly it gradually lets air out of a solanoid slowing down your reaction and consequently your 60'..if you have a fast car thsi is necissary so you can leave when the last amber comes on and not redlight). If you look in an NHRA or IHRA rule book there are rules against having any device or material attached to your vehcle for the purpose of prematurly triggering the laser beams. If you still think I'm beign stupid just imagine it on a much larger scale(greatly exjagerated) then a slightly lower PSI or shallow staging. Imagine that you attached a piece of metal that nearly scrapes the ground right down the middle of your underbody. As soon as the nose of your car got to the starting line the prestage would light up then the stage light. when you left the starting line your stage light would be on and the ET timer woudl not start untill the back of your car exited the startign line. By this time you would be a full car length down the track and have acceleration. In top eliminator once i had trans brake mal-function and my front tire rolled out of the strtaing line beforer the other guy staged..for some reason the lights dropped and i tripped the ET timer with my back tire and knocked off almost 3/4 of a second off the 1/4 mile I went 8.9 @ 139 instead of a usuall 9.6 @ 140. You cnat possibly think that if you deep stage your going to have as fast of a time as if you shallow stage do you? Now back to letting air out a frotn tire for a 60' purpose: It will be a less dramatic result then shallow staging because when you accelerate alot of the weight will be taken off of the tire but it will still help some and it was jsut an idea since you are trying to get that extra .1 of a second. Viper and other members have alot of experience tuning their v6 cars to get more horsepower out of them and as a result obvious faster 1/4 miles(if you need advice with that ask them, they can probably help you better), but i have alot of bracket racing experince..im a pro et bracket racer (sportsman no box)...at one point last season i had the 3rd highest win percentage in this class of the IHRA internationally with a record of about 22-1(one loss due to redlight in the finals) and qualified for the World Finals(didn't have a comp license last year though). So i would jsut appreciate it, Viper and who everelse laughed at the post without understanding it, that you jsut take the time to understand the concept of what im trying to explain here before immediatly cutting it down and acting like I'm an idiot. I still say that the weather is going to make the biggest difference and this trick that everyone seems to be laughing at is only good for possibly .1 or less. Good luck with getting that 14.

[wishigotan8]

Re: what am i doing wrong?

just to clearify: a lower front tire psi will slow your RT, speed up your 60' ...depending on the PSI that you actually run :rasie or lower you ET(if its too flat its obvioulsy going to slow you down in the long run otherwise it will lower your ET, although, your car isnt any faster your jsut "cheated" it off) and lower you MPH.

[Turbo V6 Camaro]

Re: what am i doing wrong?

pro or not alot of that info is false

1. reaction time only matter if you in a braket race, if not how cares about that i pull .400 or less with out trying most of the time my best .04x. but i usally i'm up around a 1 second tying to perfect my lanch lol witch is pointless no becuase my stall is to tight


low tire psi in the front will slow you down at the top of the track. James pulls 1.5 60's and he runs high tire psi

if it did help at all you would lose it at top end any way

on hard lanches your front tire dont matter that much anyway there is harldy anywieght on them

the reason the run such small tires is wieght overall and wieght transfer to the rear tire on the lanch and going down the track a small tire has hardly any drag the lights won't drop on any track i have seen unless both people are in full stage or the track guy starts the lights (auto start off)

[12secondv6]

Re: what am i doing wrong?

Wooooo, wishigotan8... there is only one problem with your suggestions... we are on earth! ;)

Ok, where to start:

"slicks" - WAY overkill for his set up. He will bog and go slower. Have you tried this? I know I have and have seen first hand how too much tire makes a slow car go slower.

"1,000-1,200 rpm" - not enough, stock converter has a stall speed of 1,800.... as you may or may not know, to go quicker you want to get into your power band quicker... raising the rpm's to 1,800 (on this year v6) will get it into the power band quicker thus reducing ET's

"let the torque converter "flash" - it's a stock converter, there are no benifits from flashing it

"a trick for lowering your 60' and changing your reaction time is to let some air out of one of your front tires" - actually, the trick is to RAISE the tire psi thus increasing the size of the front tire

"the less air makes the tire flatter=more contact patch" - thus increasing rolling resistance which makes slower ET's

"my race car " - what do you have? Pic's? Times? Vid's

"do any of you guys actually have a clue what you are doing at the race track" - yes, do you? You do not sound like you know what you are talking about.

"delay box...throttle stop " - has no bearing on this thread because we (v6's) don't run them here

"pro et bracket racer (sportsman no box)." - I have a seriously hard time believing this

"97 RS,3.73 LSD,Flowmaster,Shift Kit,Edge TC,HP Tuners,EWP,SLP CAI,160*,Touchscreen monitor,& Alpine Stereo(155.2dB)15.27 N/A 1.9X 60\'s and a magic switch." - if you REALLY were a true drag racer then why in hell did you purchase that POS edge converter? As you may or may not know, edge has a VERY low STR and effeciency rating and for a 15.2 with 3:73's and a converter that is HORRIBLE.

[wishigotan8]

Re: what am i doing wrong?

Ok you guys are just being a******s now….
1)

"slicks" - WAY overkill for his set up. He will bog and go slower. Have you tried this? I know I have and have seen first hand how too much tire makes a slow car go slower.

I agree!! thats exactly what I said…

I disagree with jsut about everyone saying you need practice,lsd and slicks for your 60'(there’s nothing wrong with a 2.1), you just need to hit a day with good air.

however..

LSD and sticky tries would help alot....

LSD and sticky tires

Slicks are only good if you absolutely need then #1 is that the PSI is as low as 6 and #2 the expand as you go down the track making your gear ratio worse(diameter increase in powered tires, raises the final drive ratio)unless theyre radials.
2)

"1,000-1,200 rpm" - not enough, stock converter has a stall speed of 1,800.... as you may or may not know, to go quicker you want to get into your power band quicker... raising the rpm's to 1,800 (on this year v6) will get it into the power band quicker thus reducing ET's

….yeah ummm BS! Call any torque converter place and they will tell you the same…just because you stall to 1800 don’t launch there…a torque converter, when its not locked up, wotn let you drop below your stall anyway. A good example is a 5000 stall converter will never drop below 5000 your entire run down the track at WOT. Yes stock stall speed is 1,800 and if you rev up to 1800 your closer to your powerband however if you are at 1200 and then go WOT off the line you instantly go to 1,800 anyway and the initial launch will be harder(slightly, very slightly in a stock converter car but your converter wont be as hot)
3)

"a trick for lowering your 60' and changing your reaction time is to let some air out of one of your front tires" - actually, the trick is to RAISE the tire psi thus increasing the size of the front tire

You didn’t think about that very long before you posted it did you??? Yes the circumference would be bigger and that would be great if the F****** lasers were a foot off the ground however “ON EARTH” they are only slightly above the ground, so by raising your tire pressure you make a more perfect circle which will result with less tire touching the ground (>contact patch) and less of the tire hitting the lasers.
4)

"the less air makes the tire flatter=more contact patch" - thus increasing rolling resistance which makes slower ET's

well your’re actually mostly right…that’s why I posted

just to clearify: a lower front tire psi will slow your RT, speed up your 60' ...depending on the PSI that you actually run :rasie or lower you ET(if its too flat its obvioulsy going to slow you down in the long run otherwise it will lower your ET, although, your car isnt any faster your jsut "cheated" it off) and lower you MPH. just to clearify: a lower front tire psi will slow your RT, speed up your 60' ...depending on the PSI that you actually run :rasie or lower you ET(if its too flat its obvioulsy going to slow you down in the long run otherwise it will lower your ET, although, your car isnt any faster your jsut "cheated" it off) and lower you MPH.

however if experiment with your PSI you can knock off more by the 60’ mark in time then you gain back going down the rest of the track…like I said, and you repeated, your mph is going to be slower though because of that resistance.
5) As for the delay box throttle stop comment….I know we don’t run these in out cars, I was explaining what they do, that fast cars can run them, and that they are for your R/T. In our classes we cant run them, like you said, so we need to be innovative and use other ways to do the same thing. That is why you would shallow stage and that is why you would lower the PSI in one of you front tires. A good side effect of it however is that it also makes your ET faster in the case of shallow staging and sometimes with the front tire. In both cases your 60’ improves.
6)

"pro et bracket racer (sportsman no box)." - I have a seriously hard time believing this

lol ok first of all it’s a fancy name like a garbage man being a sanitation engineer. The sportsman basically means amateur in the sense that you don’t go from track to track racing all over the country, you just have a home track(its what everyone here is)… the pro just means that its IHRA license and with IHRA membership you get an extra check sent to you when you win and runner up at events and there’s contingency money also. All that is, is a fancy name for the Summit Super Series which you probably all have at your tracks too. (I think I was 22-2 not 22-1 like I stated previously, sorry)
7)

"my race car " - what do you have? Pic's? Times? Vid's

sorry no digital vids some in really poor quality VHS… but timeslips and pictures I could get you, I live on campus right now so it will take awhile…I also have the World Bracket Championship Qualifier T-Shirt that you needed to be in the event and the entrence sticker and competion # is still stuck on the car. Like I said though it will be a little while before I could get you them because I live a ways away from where all this stuff is…I’m not racing the race cars yet this season I just run my V6 until schools over. It’s a 1971 firebird that looks like a 1979 because that’s the only year they make in fiberglass bodies…its powered by a N/A SBC 400 and runs about a 9.6XX. That’s a Box Class car though. What I raced in no box last year was a 1995 Corvette 383 (Lingenfelter mods)
8) One last thing you guys are dwelling on the PSI thing too much it was just an idea for him to try…like I said reapeatedly the results from it will be SMALL one way or another…my actuall suggestion was shallow staging and

i would try running all you tires fully inflated because i dont think your having problems spinning.

Because I agree with you 12secondv6 that optimally you would like to have all tires fully inflated for less resitance I just added

Also a trick for lowering your 60' and changing your reaction time is to let some air out of one of your front tires

Also I’m apologizing to everyone especially SteveThePirate that this got so out of control, I was just making a small suggestion. I didn’t mean to wreck this thread for you.

[wishigotan8]

Re: what am i doing wrong?

1. reaction time only matter if you in a braket race, if not how cares about that i pull .400 or less with out trying most of the time my best .04x.

Very true R/T has nothing to do with E.T., but “who cares about your R.T.?” kinda sounds like you do buddy…but a .400 is ******* terrible just so you know, trying or not. Also for heads up races like RSD or midnight mayhem events(simulated street racing not bracket racing) you can win races with the much slower car [i.e I cut a .02X rt you cut yoru normal 1.000 now I only have to run a 13.01 to beat you if you run your fastest time.]

low tire psi in the front will slow you down at the top of the track. James pulls 1.5 60's and he runs high tire psi

if it did help at all you would lose it at top end any way

If you remember I did tell him to run all tires fully inflated for that reason I just said you can experiment with lowering one of your fronts…your mph will slow down and you will lose at least some if not all of the time you gained in the 60 at the big end, but you may gain at least some time...it was just a small suggestion.

on hard lanches your front tire dont matter that much anyway there is harldy anywieght on them

lol yeah ummm didn’t I say that….oh yeah I did! Why do I feel like I have to reapeat myself constantly. You still are more shallow staged then you could possibly be with a fully inflated tire. Its more so for before you launch then after.

It will be a less dramatic result then shallow staging because when you accelerate alot of the weight will be taken off of the tire but it will still help some and it was jsut an idea since you are trying to get that extra .1 of a second

the reason the run such small tires is wieght overall and wieght transfer to the rear tire on the lanch and going down the track a small tire has hardly any drag the lights won't drop on any track i have seen unless both people are in full stage or the track guy starts the lights (auto start off)

True True…I said that most of them are for that reason but about 1/20 is for what I was talking about. I was just trying to get you to see the reasoning and logic behind it since you so harshly shut the idea down the first time. Also if your referring to my trans-brake story in the second half of the quote you’re right lights don’t drop until both are staged unless auto stage is engaged, when I rolled out of the light my red light was tripped but it was before any ambers came on so the timer (for some reason..i don’t honestly know why) didn’t start until my back tires went through the start line.

Also, Viper I checked out your site and I think its amazing what you did with your car(you too 12secondv6)…but does its power curve peak very quick or something? That amount of horsepower does not match your ET easily 11.5s are possible I run 12.6s with the vette and only 302RWHP..anyway good luck with it

[Turbo V6 Camaro]

Re: what am i doing wrong?

i'm not even going to try to repley cuase yyou change your story everyother post and frankly i'm confused and to tired to figure it out....

as for the dyno that was with the M5 in 4th gear turbo spools at 3800-4000 and it goes from 3 psi at 3500 to 14 psi at 4000 so it hits hard as hell, i now have an auto in tried to dyno but the don't like track tuning is cheaper anyway lol

as for my times..... if you didn't notice my 60 foot was only 1.9 for the 12.036 run and i had to let off at the end of track.... my TC is to tight and i can't biuld boost at the line.

[stevethepirate]

Re: what am i doing wrong?

ill go on a night when its fairly empty, and run both with high and low psi, and post the results, ok?