Firebird W68 - My LSX Swap thread.

[Need4Camaro]

Re: Firebird W68 - My LSX Swap thread.

I would have done some more research from the beginning and got the correct transmission to start with. I don't know how mechanically inclined you are or what tools your have access to, but you could have saved a ton of money doing this swap yourself..

At this point, I'd pull the motor and tranny. Pull the oil pan, valve cover and heads off and inspect the engine for any damage. Obviously all new gaskets when putting it back together. Ditch the transmission and find a pullout from and Firebird or Camaro that will bolt right up. I may even buy a harness pulled from one of these cars too just to be on the safe side.

Assuming the engine is good, you should be able to do what I've mentioned for under $1500... minus labor if you're having someone else do it. And NO performance upgrades until it's running right.

It's a long story, I never would have found out about the transmission until I attempted to bolt it up as its an identical 4L60E with a slightly different shorter bellhousing / inputshaft - Everything else is the same on it. I got it from a guy who rebuilds 4L60E's but didnt attempt to install it until 6 months later when I had everything I needed for the swap so there was no way I could have found out it was the wrong transmission until then. Never would have thought to check it as my transmission guy even told me it was from a 01 Z28. By the time I found out it was already too late and I was on a time limit as I had to move out the city and needed the car assembled so I could take it with me so I was forced to adapt it to work via a TH400 Adapter (it's an LT1 transmission.) as it would have taken too much time to get the correct one at that time.

I would have done the swap myself but I lived in an apartment and the car was parked on a street (no parking lot) lived in a city at the time so I didn't have the tools or space, was well aware I would save alot of money doing it that way but I didnt have the ability or time to.

I like the idea though ...Probably going to need a new flexplate however.

I would at this point get the pullout of the LS1 if you have the money. That way you have the correct tranny also.

Yeah probably is the best bet to have everything compatible. I just really wanted a new motor too... I was thinking of biting the bullet and doing a long block LQ9 and a rebuilt 4L60E this time from a reputable tranny shop 4L60E that way everythings new but thats ganna be roughly $5k... the pullout would PROBABLY be the most convenient way to solve ALL the problems (transmission aswell)... Im not sure. The main reason I'm hesitant about it is because I wanted a low mileage motor since I technically already have one. I really gotta think about it... What did you think of the LS6 idea btw?

[r_simmonds]

Re: Firebird W68 - My LSX Swap thread.

I was looking through some of the older posts on this thread, and noticed a couple of things. One, the intake manifold you had pictures of does appear to be an LS6 piece. Just for future reference, all LS1 engines from 2001-04, regardless of the car it was put in from the factory, had LS6 intake manifolds and injectors. This means no EGR provision. It also means that if you want an LS6 manifold for a project, you don't have to buy a brand new one, you only need to look for a used piece from an '01-'02 F-body, '01-'04 Corvette, '04 GTO, and a couple of others I can't remember off of the top of my head.

As far as throttle bodies go, the 4.8, 5.3, and LS1 all had the exact same throttle body, unless the LS1 was in a Corvette. If you want a slightly larger throttle body, some of the 6.0 HD trucks had a cable driven 80mm throttle body and MAF sensor.

I wouldn't try to bore and stroke a 4.8 or 5.3 with the stock cylinder heads. You'd have to have special pistons to bring the compression back down to a reasonable ratio. You can however bore a 5.3 and use LS1 pistons, have the crank balanced, have the heads ported lightly, and use a decent cam, and end up with around 500 hp at the crank. If you want to do a 383, you can use a 5.3 iron block, have to bored to the LS1's 3.898, get a stroker crank, and use a set of LS2 heads (LS2 and LS6 heads are the same #243 casting) for much cheaper than buying aftermarket or brand new LS6 heads. Built properly, 550-600 hp would be easily obtained. If you were to use an iron 6.0 block, you can switch to the L92/LS3 style heads, use an L76 cable throttle intake, and have it bored and stroked to just past the 400 cid mark. Be warned though, at the power levels a build like this would be putting down, a stock 7.5 10 bolt rear axle is going to turn into dust the first time you stomp the throttle. And, only a built transmission would live behind it for more than a few drives up the street.

As far as the transmission, you can get a 4L60E or 4L65E that will handle between 800-1000 hp and lb-ft tq. The upside to this, is that the 60 and 65 series transmissions require less power to turn than a larger 80 series and the more stout TH350 and 400, as well as give you the advantage of 4 gears with an overdrive.

An aluminum flexplate is a horrible idea for a car, unless it is a strip only car. You can however get a lighter weight steel flexplate. And I would stay conservative with the stall speed if you're planning on driving the car much. A 3200 stall seems a bit excessive if you're building it for the street. Staying in the 2000-2500 range would keep in much more suitable for street use, but still allow you to get into the powerband quicker, especially given most Gen 3 V8's start to hit their torque curve around 2500 rpm.

The coolant line for the throttle body on a Gen 3 V8 is not a necessity. You'll find that many owners bypass this passage.

I'm sure most of this is irrelevant to you at this point. I just felt like throwing out a few facts and putting in my 2 cents.

[Need4Camaro]

Re: Firebird W68 - My LSX Swap thread.

Things have been going bad for me lately. Upon returning to Atlanta I've been struck with family crisis, debt and I just now wrecked my dads truck causing a 4 car pileup and just found out our insurance company made a mistake and didn't add full coverage to our policy...liability only when I explicitly asked for full coverage on a financed vehicle meaning I have to repair it or dad gets sued. The Firebird is finally being worked on and should be done by mid may but I have to keep it extremely budgeted for now. Staying with the 5.3 and LT1 Transmission for a year then Im going to buy a Prius for a DD and build a 383 striker out of my current motor and procharge it

[ssms5411]

Re: Firebird W68 - My LSX Swap thread.

Well hopefully your luck will change soon. You can only have so much bad luck before it changes. Good luck

[Meatyshells]

Re: Firebird W68 - My LSX Swap thread.

by law dont you have to have full coverage for a financed vehicle?
I remember my friend got into an accident, the insurance company said he only had liability on his financed car.

Not sure exactly what happen, but the insurance company said oh yeah we made a "mistake"

[Need4Camaro]

Re: Firebird W68 - My LSX Swap thread.

by law dont you have to have full coverage for a financed vehicle?
I remember my friend got into an accident, the insurance company said he only had liability on his financed car.

Not sure exactly what happen, but the insurance company said oh yeah we made a "mistake"

Depending on the state but yes here in Georgia its required by law. Im ganna call some attorneys and see what they say.

Meanwhile to add to my streak of bad luck the shop pulled the heads and found out my motor isn't a 5.3 ...ITS A 4.8 I paid $900 for... Im thinking of sueing my previous mechanic. H e was able to tell by the pistons. They're flat tops.

[CFreed11]

Re: Firebird W68 - My LSX Swap thread.

You need to take some type of legal action for all the crap you've been put through with that car. It sounds like most of the issues stemmed from your mechanic performing the swap and him not using correct parts or procedures to do it right.

[bigbrian442]

Re: Firebird W68 - My LSX Swap thread.

Didn't you check casting numbers or production codes when you bought it?

[Need4Camaro]

Re: Firebird W68 - My LSX Swap thread.

You need to take some type of legal action for all the crap you've been put through with that car. It sounds like most of the issues stemmed from your mechanic performing the swap and him not using correct parts or procedures to do it right.

Didn't you check casting numbers or production codes when you bought it?

Originally no I didn't check any numbers as I didn't think to ensure it wasn't a 4.8. Would it have been smart? definitely ... just wasn't on my mind to do that as I put alittle too much confidence in the mechanic.

I should really go after the Guy but I'm not sure if I really want to because I can see a case like this getting messy real fast since this is all custom done at home work.

We are running the numbers on it as I found out it could also be a L33 as they also came with flattop pistons ... It did feel stout when driving it so maybe... If the numbers return a 4.7 Identification though I will at the very minimum demand the difference in price to be returned to me.

[ssms5411]

Re: Firebird W68 - My LSX Swap thread.

I would def. try and get some money back , now you know why the tranny didn't fit.

[Need4Camaro]

Re: Firebird W68 - My LSX Swap thread.

I'm getting extremely aggitated by this situation.

Okay.

For the engine, neither of us know what it truly is. There's a possability it could also be an L33 which Im mildly leaning toward seeing as though for the brief moment I drove it, it didn't feel like a slouch. But the shop would have to tear down the whole motor to find out and I'm not ganna foot the bill to do that, I just want a running car at this point.

Right now I have a new and much bigger problem, time... My car has been in the same shop since January and I'm still waiting on him to finish it. He told me in January he had a good few people ahead of me because Spring season was on the way and that was track season so I understood that and plus I trust the guy as he's brought my car back from the dead once and has done otherwise great work for me before.

Around March I paid him half labor up front (and what I thought was also for parts) as requested and asked him if he knew when he would beable to begin on the car and got no real answer until April when he told me that he was in process of moving his shop to a larger building and as soon as his move was complete my car would be the first one on the lift and he didnt start earlier because he just didn't want my car in pieces when he had to vacate his current building. He also assured me it wouldnt be beyond May because he couldn't stay in his current building beyond then hence why he didnt want my car in pieces. I said okay cool fine and dandy. Well, end of April / Beggining of May is here and I hear nothing from him, give him about a week into May (and keep in mind this is after I wrecked my dad's truck which I'm paying $5,000 in repairs for). I work Monday through Friday between 10 AM and 6:30 PM and the commute plus my work hours overlap all of his business hours except for Saturday, which is a day I have to pretty much play catchup for everything else. I went there one Saturday evening and he wasnt around and caught another local business of his and they told him I came at 6:30 in the evening (which was the only opportunity I had because he's off Sunday, I only have 1 car sharing with family and have to do their arrons over the weekend as well.) Well he emails me telling me about his friend spotting me there that evening and requested that I email him before coming by incase he's not around or is busy. So now I stop going to his shop and communicate solely through email / text and I then even ask if maybe this job was just alittle too in depth and he assured me he's seen and corrected far worse. Mid May is approaching and I ask him if he cant begin within a week if I can just be reimbursed for what I paid him and take my car elsewhere who has alittle more availability. He tells me he can begin so I go with it. Things go on, find out about the possibility of the 4.8 and then tells me my steering rack has to be replaced (which I informed him and thought I paid him to do up front) and refers me to advanced auto to purchase the parts which I was a bit unprepared to do because I thought everything I paid upfront covered the parts, fine though. He orders them for me on his business account and I am prepared to pay for them and then, family runs into issues and needs $400 from me and swears they'll pay me back in the next two days and seeing as though its for their mortgage I helped them. two days later my dad acts like he knows nothing about it and I get no money back and am forced to wait until my next pay date. Meanwhile my mechanic informs me if I cant get the parts soon he has to take the car off the rack and it'll just have to go back on the next opportunity he can (which really scares me as I don't want to wait another 5 months for that next opportunity) I attempt to get the money sooner but am unable to.

I call Advanced Auto Parts over the phone and they quote me $240 for the parts necessary on my shops business account and I thought he rolled the core charge into that. So I get paid and trek 50 miles out of my way to the shop where he ordered the parts on top of risking being late for work so they could be delivered to his shop before the weekend. I get there and the manager pulls up an entirely different quote of almost $400 which made me jump out of my pants and I was like, Can I speak to the guy who quoted my original order? and the manager is like, "No I'm the manager and this is what you have to pay." I say "well look it was made on his business account its quite apparent the mechanic has the core." He replies "Well YOU have to pay the core I'm not losing my job over it." I reply I understand but I wasn't told anything about the core and I came 50 f*cking miles out of my way on information I wasn't even told about. I only came with what I was told I needed" And then he says "I'm the manager and you don't talk to me like that and if you either pay the core or I'll call the police and escort you out of the store." I... lost my temper when he said that and cursed profusely and ...I still didnt leave with multiple threats of calling the police... but at the last minute I finally left.

That wasn't the smartest way to react I know.

In any case the auto store calls the shop 3 times informing him of what I did which upsets my mechanic as I am now in danger of jeopordising his business account. Short story..I have to wait till the pay day after that to buy the parts (from the same auto parts store I might add) and I only did it to keep things convinient, simple and fast. I honestly could have gotten it much cheaper through RockAuto but the last thing I need is an angry mechanic telling me "this won't fit, and I'm still charging you for labor".

Anyway. He gets the parts and I hear nothing from him once again. for almost a week until I finally get a hold of him and he tells me he has the parts (they were delivered the same day I paid for them) and tells me he'll get my car back on the rack soon and finish it up. I was also was aware that I needed A/C work done, THIS TIME I just paypal'd him the money to buy all the A/C Parts necessary and over a week after the paypal, calling, texting, emailing and no responses he finally tells me everything was fine and he'd touch base with me again later and he's just been slammed. during those emails I asked if he happened to know about when he could finish the car, if atleast by the end of June... no response to that.

Later I've been asking for his shipping address (because he moved his shop) so I could send him O2 sensors (my two fronts are bad) and a few other small things and heard no response...Calling, emailing, same difference I cant get in touch with him. I also asked for ETA's and still no response.

This guy is a vendor on LS1tech and I actually do respect his work as he's done alot for me in the past but I can't go till January without my car... What should I do? If I try to take it back he would still have to put it together as its in pieces currently, he just had the headwork done, steering rack disassembled, there HAS been work done to the car but I would have to pay for labor to have all of that reconnected - he hasnt even sent the core rack back to advanced auto and thats been a month ago.

I really don't want to blow up on this guy as he's a semi-friend and I like his work I just dont wanna wait till next year for my car. What do you suggest?

[ssms5411]

Re: Firebird W68 - My LSX Swap thread.

I would just give him the time and see if he can do it , in a timely manner. If not have it done somewhere else. I would just give him a date to do it or else it gets done somewhere else ,have him commit to a date it will get done so that way if he doesn't get it done by the date he can't get mad over you taking it somewhere else.

[Need4Camaro]

Re: Firebird W68 - My LSX Swap thread.

I would just give him the time and see if he can do it , in a timely manner. If not have it done somewhere else. I would just give him a date to do it or else it gets done somewhere else ,have him commit to a date it will get done so that way if he doesn't get it done by the date he can't get mad over you taking it somewhere else.

Update:
I went to his shop about 3 weeks ago and delivered some O2 Sensors to him and was informed I needed a new Y-Pipe (I knew this too). He was still busy and told me he had 2 cars ahead of me so I asked if it would be about Mid-July? He told me yeah somewhere around there should be good. A week later, because I knew my car was ganna be sitting outside in summer heat for a long time I decided to come back an Armor-All the dashboard so it wouldn't crack. He was there and told me he had an exhaust system I would be able to use from a friend of his and I would need to PayPal his friend for it. It was a complete Magnaflow Exhaust brand new barely used for $190. I told him I'd do it on Friday when I get paid. I asked him for his friends PayPal information and he didn't have it on hand and I just told him that's fine just email it to me and he agreed to do it before the day ended. Well that night, no email. Monday rolls around and I send a reminder email (because the Holiday is coming up and I wanted to get the email so I could PayPal the guy exactly when I got paid as I dont like holding onto money) Tuesday comes, no response. I send another reminder email and text. Wednesday comes and no response and I call him and get voice mail, leave a message and no response. 4th of July I don't bother... - Today I found another shop who works on these cars and was told they would have availability by the 23rd of July and I could bring it by then. I did try to reach my current mechanic today once again and got no response once again and I sent him an email telling him I'd just have the exhaust done at an exhaust shop (mainly because I just want my car out of his shop asap at this point.)

But Im beggining to feel very uneasy about this guy for several reasons.

#1 He's not communicating
#2 He never really gives me even an estimated price
#3 He's had my car since January and never gives me a real completion time

I already paid him $1,000 up front -- technically $700 for labor and $300 for A/C parts that I doubt he's purchased yet... but I am highly considering towing the car and just leaving that $1k for the work he's done so far and moving on to another shop. If he won't let it go then take it to court...

What do you guys think though?

[FIREBIRDV6RAGE]

The same happened to me when the original engine of my birds heads blew paid a guy and a month later I went to his shop and it was empty. Just my car sitting there all dirty. With the some guy out there that worked for the bank.I asked him where did they go. He told ne I. Spanish "the buisness went down hill a week ago. Is that your car the one that's red. I said "yea" he told me here , some guy told me to give you this. It was my keys. The car ran untill it broke down again a mile away from home . I was going like 70. Then the car didn wana go. I saw the rpms drop to 1000 and the oil psi to 0. I pull to the side and tbe car wont start. I let it cool down and it ran again but with a nasty tick.tick.tick.tick going on and it wouldent even go after that.That engine was gone along with my money.That I had worked for *(I was only 16 at the time). Never heard any thing from him ever again. It really ticked me off. The summer came and I worked for 3 months and just got an engine swap. For 1200. 1 day of senor year came and I had my car. Only person with a bird at my school.

I say you go with your gut man. I myself was learning about cars and my parents didn't trust me working on my car. But now I do my own work and learn. Next thing on my list is keeping the v6 going untill I can do a ls1 swap.
If he don't want to pay up then take em to court. He made you wait a year and still has done almost nothing.
Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

[Need4Camaro]

Re: Firebird W68 - My LSX Swap thread.

I tried to go to his shop early today but it was closed (wasnt closed last Saturday). I checked my car and found that the engine is still in the cradle but the heads are off and in the machine shop still.

There's something thats worrying me alot...

If I have my car towed to another shop without warning him... he may never return my heads or my O2 sensors to me which will hike my costs up atleast by another $500...what can I do about this?

If I warn him about towing my car he may end up putting it inside his shop and haggling me for more money although he's done nothing... Technically he wasted $1,000 of mine if I pull it from him because I still have to pay him for the labor and time and I dont get a running...or even an assembled car..