can i get anything besides hp tuners?

[White95]

well I know that can't do anything for a 3.4L f-body...I emailed them and asked

[Turbo V6 Camaro]

Originally posted by AllTheGoodNamesAreGone:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Jerriko:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by AllTheGoodNamesAreGone:
I looked into DHP's oferings..

I was not impressed.. that and their "side by side" table, which compairs it to hptuners.. is the most out of date one sided-POS i have ever seen..

HPtuners is the way to go, its hard to explane w/o letting you see it in person.. because its jsut that dam good..

Are you saying that because you have tried both or just don't like DHP? Many times we have gone to the tracks and people were introduced to both at the same time and choosen DHP over HPTuners. Now incase you didn't notice, this thread was started by someone who wants something BESIDES hpfoolers. </font>[/QUOTE]I have seen it on a grand prix..

1) They are liers, plan and simple if you look at the feature comparison chart.. it is convienently "not up to date"..

2) From what I have seen in the screen shots the acctual tuning software is not as complete

3) The scanner is less then impressive

4) no widband, or outputs..

other then that it seems fine..
my main concern is the scanner.. It is the most citritcal tool IMHO.. with the HPT scanner you cna be a complete moron (read: people like me) and still be able to tune your car.. and with the wideband capabilitys (which i use) I have never taken the car to the dyno..

its priceless really..

This is all not to mention what HPT has in store for the future.. IF you are planning on running an FI car.. tehy have some big things they are considering that would help alot.. primaraly table expansions..

dunno.. their software just strikes me as second rate..

Bottom line is, HPT is leading as far as speed, functionality, and features.. for ls1's and 3.8's.. and they seems deticated on keeping that lead.. dhp and carputing need to play a game of catch up..

I have a tendency to buy only the "best".. even if that meens i have to pay a few bucks more.. </font>[/QUOTE]accualy you can hook a wideband up to the DHP one $499. and they offer more tuning for the V6, with HPT we always get pushed to the side
i think im going with DHP. to save 150 bucks and since they most support the v6's we don't get put on the back buner everytime there is a issue

[AllTheGoodNamesAreGone]

Originally posted by viper04af:
accualy you can hook a wideband up to the DHP one $499. and they offer more tuning for the V6, with HPT we always get pushed to the side
i think im going with DHP. to save 150 bucks and since they most support the v6's we don't get put on the back buner everytime there is a issue

I dont see any info about wideband inputs on their site..

define "more tuning"

Pushed to the side?? when/how? I have never had this problem.. I cannot say i have ever seen an exclusive "v6 issue" to begine with.. let alone one that is critical that was not resolved in under 24 hours..

this is all not to mention the 5-6 times that the guys at HPT have added new features, tables, and funtionality that I had requested (in under 24 hours)

This is keith we are taking about here, "magnus" remember him?? If there is anyone that I have seen do great things for our community it was him. I have known him for a while now, and he is not the type that "pushes things aside".

so lets hear it? when were you pushed aside?

how are we not supported? if there is something you want added/changed ask and it gets taken care of..

so, whatever man..

again.. I am a firm beliver in market competition.. (it makes things cheeper for us all )

however.. i have a hard time making a case for dhp
1) its simply not as well featured
2) they cant keep their own website current
3) many many other "opinions" that i will keep to
myself because i am trying to be objective..

bottom line, keith knows his stuff, and he has helped us all (in this forum for christ sake) in my case 1000000's of times.. the software is superior..

and you all want to jump ship for some company that blows smoke up your "behinds".. to save a few dollers..

regardless, good luck with it..

[ November 27, 2004, 05:31 AM: Message edited by: AllTheGoodNamesAreGone ]

[beyerch]

Wow. I'm not sure who this is, but I can take a guess considering what state you are from. [img]smile.gif[/img] ;)

The product comparison on our website is comparing the 1.1.6 DHP versus the 1.4 HP Tuenrs and for that comparison it is 100% accurate.

As SOON as I can get a chance to update it for their new 1.5 and our 1.1.8, I'll post that. In the meantime ANYONE who has emailed me has been told about the current differences and I'd be more than happy to spell it all out.

The bottom line is still that we have tuned and mapped v6 3100, 3400, 3800 since 2001 and they just released stuff in may of this year. We know our tables and mapping are right in the editor. We offer more product support, more editor features, our scantool is a TAD behind as I have not been able to add case learns yet, and I'm still working on a partial flash for the programmer (our full flash only takes 2.5 minutes tho).

The other difference, our basic version is $399 ($325 currently for fbody guys) while their's is $499. The A/D (analog to digital input version) for us is $499 to their $649. We were also the first to release A/D for what its worth.

We also have FREE software upgrades, period. Not for 6 months, not for 1 year, just FREE. We have PHONE support, email support, and a webforum for support. Our competitor does not offer any form of PHONE support.

Finally, I'm going to jack anyone around. From day one we have been in this to make v6 calibrations and to support all of the communities we sell product for. I'm not going to tool around say one thing and then magically pull a 180 on you guys....

Thanks

Charles

Originally posted by AllTheGoodNamesAreGone:
I looked into DHP's oferings..

I was not impressed.. that and their "side by side" table, which compairs it to hptuners.. is the most out of date one sided-POS i have ever seen..

HPtuners is the way to go, its hard to explane w/o letting you see it in person.. because its jsut that dam good..

[beyerch]

allow me to address your points line by line.

1) They are liers, plan and simple if you look at the feature comparison chart.. it is convienently "not up to date"..

Actually, if you check the file date on that page, it was released well before 1.5 came out. Furthermore, NONE of our new product features have been added to the product comparison chart either. I have many hats including that website and I can't do it all, all the time. If it were a "convenient" not up to date, then I would have added our new prdouct features to it while ignoring theirs; however, that is not the reality. I do apologize that it is not 100% up to date, but believe it or not HPTuners doesn't send me a feature list so I actually ahve to find someone with te product so that I can evaluate it as well..... I guess I could just make stuff up ?

2) From what I have seen in the screen shots the acctual tuning software is not as complete

Actually, I think you are mistaken. The HPTuner, editing software ONLY allows you to work with one file at a time. While in that one file, you have a few choices for what to change. It does allow you to make mass changes to tables in an all or nothing variety. They do also include some 3d graphics for editing which are limited in what thye can do (if you're used this I don't need ot explain.). They also do color shade the data tables, but I beg the question... what do the colors mean ? (i.e. green = good? red = bad?) It seems they just make the color go toward red as the # increases; however, that dosen't really do much. They do not reference it against an "original" value or anything.

The Powrtuner allows you to open and edit and number of files at once. You have MANY options for making changes .

#1 - You can either make mass changes to an entrie data table by highlighting the WHOLE table and then using the right click feature to make % difference changes, FILL data, or Add a fixed # to the current values.
#2 - You can Import data into a table via a file (.CSV, .XML, or .BIN). For instance a friend can send you his MAF table and then you can import it into your calibration file by right clicking on your airflow table adn selecting 'Import From File'
#3 - You can Export data from your frile to send to someone else. You can export data from yoru file, by simply right clicking on the data item and then selecting 'Export'. You can save the data in HTML, XML, CSV, or pure BINARY. You can then either conveniently post this info on your website or email it to your friend.
#4 - If you really goof something up you can alwasy revert it back to the stock original value. All you have to do is right click and then select 'Import Stock Setting'. Your table is magically reverted back to stock original.
#5 - The editor has warnings to ensure that you do not enter in an invalid value in a table. If you exceed the min or max values, it will not allow you to continue until you fix it. The editor also has a copy of the stock values for every parameter you change. Because of this it can also watch for a change % and warn you if you are over a predetermined warning level.
#6 - For each data parameter, you can view its ORIGINAL STOCK value at any time. This allows you to do a side by side comparison of the curent value versus the stock value.
#7 - Our editor employs a "change log" which allows you to view a list of each and every change you have made to your PCM File. With this you have a quick way to see what you have done to the file.
#8 - We DO NOT have fancy looking graphs which offer little workability and I do not color code table cells. I'm going to add a coloring system though; however, it will actualy show yuou the % difference between the current value and the origianl. For instance the FARTHER away from the stock setting you go, the more towards RED it will go. It will not just get more RED as the # increases.......
#9 - Also, if you want to copy an object such as a MAF table from one file to another and you have them both open in the editor, you can simply "drag and drop" the item to the other file and it will automatically update the file.
#10 - Our editor is designed in a way as to only show you the parameters that you can ACTUALLY EDIT. We do not show you a list of a ton of parameters and then have items missing, greyed out, or have phantom tabs. (for instance having a M6 Transmission tab in a A4 car.)

If you refer tou our OUTDATED USER MANUAL (see at least i'm consistent) [img]smile.gif[/img] YOu can see a pretty good breakdown of the editor functions.

3) The scanner is less then impressive

Sorry john, you sold yours too soon. [img]smile.gif[/img] I will admit the first versions of the scanner were aything but impressive as it was not our focus. I have spent the past 2 months tweaking the scanner and it will be quite impressive. I will post links to the NEW scanner later today. (I don't have any screen shots handy.)

4) no widband, or outputs..

NOT TRUE. WE were the first to release a wideband interface. Our compeitition DOES have "otuputs". Basically you can use the outputs to trigger something given conditions in the scantool. HOwever, we choose not to go that route since the scantool in our software has configurable warnings, alerts, and events (such as start/stop log, or flash the screen, or make a sound).

This is all not to mention what HPT has in store for the future.. IF you are planning on running an FI car.. tehy have some big things they are considering that would help alot.. primaraly table expansions..

dunno.. their software just strikes me as second rate..

Bottom line is, HPT is leading as far as speed, functionality, and features.. for ls1's and 3.8's.. and they seems deticated on keeping that lead.. dhp and carputing need to play a game of catch up..

As far as this goes, HPTuners released their product in ... May of 2004 after 8 or 9 months of work, according to them. We were not even starting our product until Apr 2004. Of course we ahve some catchup and I think that we will be overtakign them in the next month or two for what the everday guy needs. Our last area right now is the scanner and it is currently being addressed.

As I said before though, WE are plenty dedicated to the v6 community and have been so since late 2001. WE are not going anywhere. Finally we value our communities and do not berate them or con them by making grand claims and then not delivering.

$.02
Charles

Originally posted by AllTheGoodNamesAreGone:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Jerriko:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by AllTheGoodNamesAreGone:
I looked into DHP's oferings..

I was not impressed.. that and their "side by side" table, which compairs it to hptuners.. is the most out of date one sided-POS i have ever seen..

HPtuners is the way to go, its hard to explane w/o letting you see it in person.. because its jsut that dam good..

Are you saying that because you have tried both or just don't like DHP? Many times we have gone to the tracks and people were introduced to both at the same time and choosen DHP over HPTuners. Now incase you didn't notice, this thread was started by someone who wants something BESIDES hpfoolers. </font>[/QUOTE]I have seen it on a grand prix..

1) They are liers, plan and simple if you look at the feature comparison chart.. it is convienently "not up to date"..

2) From what I have seen in the screen shots the acctual tuning software is not as complete

3) The scanner is less then impressive

4) no widband, or outputs..

other then that it seems fine..
my main concern is the scanner.. It is the most citritcal tool IMHO.. with the HPT scanner you cna be a complete moron (read: people like me) and still be able to tune your car.. and with the wideband capabilitys (which i use) I have never taken the car to the dyno..

its priceless really..

This is all not to mention what HPT has in store for the future.. IF you are planning on running an FI car.. tehy have some big things they are considering that would help alot.. primaraly table expansions..

dunno.. their software just strikes me as second rate..

Bottom line is, HPT is leading as far as speed, functionality, and features.. for ls1's and 3.8's.. and they seems deticated on keeping that lead.. dhp and carputing need to play a game of catch up..

I have a tendency to buy only the "best".. even if that meens i have to pay a few bucks more.. </font>[/QUOTE]

[beyerch]

Originally posted by White95:
well I know that can't do anything for a 3.4L f-body...I emailed them and asked

That's not "exactly" what I said [img]smile.gif[/img] I said if you send me a vin # and I will see if there's anything possible. I'm not very hopeful as we mostly do 96 and newer but if I can get a peek at the file and see if its anything like the others, there would be a chance.

Charles

[beyerch]

[/QUOTE] I dont see any info about wideband inputs on their site..
[/quote]

Oh yeah, I "conveniently" forgot to tout our newest features too and that we were teh first to release wideband support ! Damn you're right, I am a liar. [img]smile.gif[/img] :( [img]smile.gif[/img] As I stated to your earlier post, I am truly a very busy person and unfortunately, marketing my own product takes a 2nd seat to development as this clearly illustrates. If I were truly trying to lie to the public, I'd have pasted our first to market wideband support all over our website and not discussed theirs. However, the reality is, that page has not been updated since I put it. I will make it a priority this week though.

define "more tuning"

While HPT has added some more tables recently, we still offer more calibration parameters in our editor. Secondly we know they are correct and have the correct scaling functions. If you use the editors side by side you will notice some difference in how certain parameters operate and that some editors do not make changes the same way ....

Pushed to the side?? when/how? I have never had this problem.. I cannot say i have ever seen an exclusive "v6 issue" to begine with.. let alone one that is critical that was not resolved in under 24 hours..

If you find the fiero swap guy I think he has a list of items that have not been corrected that he has reported numerous times.

this is all not to mention the 5-6 times that the guys at HPT have added new features, tables, and funtionality that I had requested (in under 24 hours)

That is great service, no argument here. WE also will do the same and have done the same for our PowrTuner product. I put in about 15 hours a day and you can almost always find me online, email, or the cell.

This is keith we are taking about here, "magnus" remember him?? If there is anyone that I have seen do great things for our community it was him. I have known him for a while now, and he is not the type that "pushes things aside".

I know keith quite well....... I also remember him slamming our products in 2002 for 'raping the community' with our $299 price point. I also remember him telling everyone about $50 programmers. Evidentally he forgot to multiply by 10. I'm not saying that I'm not trying to make money. I AM. But I have been that way since day 1.

however.. i have a hard time making a case for dhp
1) its simply not as well featured
2) they cant keep their own website current
3) many many other "opinions" that i will keep to
myself because i am trying to be objective..

See previous posts for answers to #1 and #2. #3 is ridiculous. I'm so tired of the well I have my reasons but can't say. If you really had a reason, lets hear it. If you don't spare all of us.

bottom line, keith knows his stuff, and he has helped us all (in this forum for christ sake) in my case 1000000's of times.. the software is superior..

And who did Keith call back in the day when he was trying to figure stuff out. I'll give you one guess.....

and you all want to jump ship for some company that blows smoke up your "behinds".. to save a few dollers..

#1 - I'm not blowing any smoke. Explain to me how. We've done 3800 V6 (and 3100 and 3400) since 2001 and we KNOW what we're doing. Sure, I may not be on these boards each and every day, but its not feasible for me to be everywhere. I spend my time developing products which are now HERE for this market.
#2 - Its not a few dollars... We're talking $175 dollars ($325 Preorder vs $499 hpt retail).


The PowrTuner *WILL* have some edges to get worked out for hte fbody market as does ANY new product. With timely feedback from teh beta/preorder group anything found will be dealt with as efficiently as possible and we are ALWAYS looking for input to improve the product!

I apologize for the mini-flame war here, but I am not going to sit back while ONE member of this community wants to attack a product he claims to not even have used repeatedly......

Thanks !

Charles

[Karolina915]

Charles, can you link me to your comparison webpage or to your product page that explains all the features?

[97rs4life]

yea I would just like to say thanks to DHP for offering us fbody guys another tuning software. I dunno what people are complaining about. They first complain we have nothing for tuning then we get two that are good and then people rip the newest tuning software apart. I just don't get you HATERS. Stop hating and encourage the people that are trying to help us v6ers out. If you don't like one tuning program don't buy it, buy the one you like, but please don't try and push the one you don't like out of business. It would be horrible to lose people that are dedicated to improving our cars.

[AllTheGoodNamesAreGone]

Originally posted by beyerch:

I apologize for the mini-flame war here, but I am not going to sit back while ONE member of this community wants to attack a product he claims to not even have used repeatedly......

;) No appoloigy nessisary.. I found your post informative..

update your god dam website..

again.. the only advantage i see as far as "current" offerings go is output to XML and changelog stuff..

and to be honest.. I doubt i would ever use the xml feature, and well, I make my own changelogs..

I put each revision i make in a unique folder, and throw a text file in there.. not too hard

and to answer your question, yes you can open more then one file at a time now.. and you can directly copy/paste tables (you allways have been able to)..

again.. not seeing the benifits.. beyond lower cost..

good luck with your product, I hope to see some competition for keith/hpt.. that meens everyone gets better software..

[Turbo V6 Camaro]

Originally posted by 97rs4life:
yea I would just like to say thanks to DHP for offering us fbody guys another tuning software. I dunno what people are complaining about. They first complain we have nothing for tuning then we get two that are good and then people rip the newest tuning software apart. I just don't get you HATERS. Stop hating and encourage the people that are trying to help us v6ers out. If you don't like one tuning program don't buy it, buy the one you like, but please don't try and push the one you don't like out of business. It would be horrible to lose people that are dedicated to improving our cars.

not only that DHP does 96 PCMS

DHP you should lookinto the 95.5 fbody that way you have the hole group covered... ;)

[beyerch]

someone post a 95 vin # and I'll see if there's anything we can do with it.

thanks!

as far as the website, I"m doing my best ! [img]smile.gif[/img] :( [img]smile.gif[/img]

[Turbo V6 Camaro]

95 3.4 VIN - 2G1FP22S6S2196505

i can't find a 95 3.8 vin online :(

[beyerch]

back from turkey day... i'll look into that 95 .....

charles