ls1 swap vs. super charger

[blackbyrd]

what would be the cost analysis of the 2? i know more power would be possible out of a v8 than super charging a v6. this is just a curiosity thing to see the costs involved between the 2 like installs and other issus that would come up price wise. hope i put this in the right place

[christopher h]

consider the fact that an LT1 swap and a v6supercharged roughly cost the same price, and then consider that you can sell ur v6. [img]smile.gif[/img] i dunno if thats 100% right, but i beleive it is

[gregmondro]

i'd assume that if you do a v8 engine swap, that you'd get more bang out of your buck for the simple fact that you'll be getting over 300hp right away (ls1 engine) and then after you mod it, you'll be getting more, so you're not stuck with the v6 as the bottle neck.

also like the last post said, you'll also be able to sell the v6 engine (most likely)

[nino]

it will cost you twice as much to do a swap than to supercharge. or you could turbo. that would be more than SC but less than a swap-probably. a swap could cost you 2 grand if you bought a wrecked Z for 2 grand (highly unlikely) and did all the work yourself. for me the swap was going to be $6,000. and thats cause i was buying the cheaper of the salvaged engines.

[Rick M.]

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by nino:
it will cost you twice as much to do a swap than to supercharge. or you could turbo. that would be more than SC but less than a swap-probably. a swap could cost you 2 grand if you bought a wrecked Z for 2 grand (highly unlikely) and did all the work yourself. for me the swap was going to be $6,000. and thats cause i was buying the cheaper of the salvaged engines.<hr></blockquote>

The supercharger costs ~3700. I can get a real low mileage LS1 with tranny, pcm, and wiring harness for 4 grand. And with the LS1 your basically gaining about 185hp (they put around 385 to the fw I believe) compared to the almost 100 you'd get with the 9lb that no one can use because of slipping, so I'm guessing the 6lb would be even less (If I'm wrong on any numbers, please step in and correct me). And from what I've seen the swap is pretty much straightforward and shouldn't be THAT difficult to do...

[ May 21, 2003: Message edited by: Rick M. ]</p>

[Magnus]

Figure $3800 to do a LS1 swap... IF you do the labor yourself.

[Ike]

Don't forget to add in the cost for gas and insurance over the time period that you plan to keep your car. In the long run, even a heavily moddified v6 is cheaper (~$10k) than a v8.

[Magnus]

I think gas is cheaper for the LS1.. I can run a longer gear like 3.23 vs the 4.10's I needed for the V6 and can achieve half throttle performace with the ls1 that matched WOT performance of the V6.

[Ike]

you "could" but who really would?
Besides that $200/year pails in comparison to the insurance premium ~$1200/year. But you could bypass that one by not telling your insurance company. However, I much prefer to stay legal.

[blackbyrd]

thanks for all of the help guys the only reason i brought it up was i plan to do a swap when i graduate from college ( 2 to 3 years) or if i go on co op cause then would get more money but anyway i appreciate all of the help but another thought came to mind. considering i knew how, what if i just built the motor my self instead of buying a gm one or a salvaged motor. like just get the block and do all performance internals heads and intake manifolds. would that shave off some of the cost cause by the time i get ready to do this there not likely be any low milage ls1 around do to the fact taht they quit making the car and i would just assume have a brand new one anyway. so would it be cheaper to build it myself or just by a motor?

[John_D.]

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by blackbyrd:
what if i just built the motor my self instead of ...a salvaged motor. like just get the block and do all performance internals heads and intake manifolds.<hr></blockquote>

I thought about this too...

One problem you run into, is you are going to need the brackets and acessories for the LS1 too. Probably easier to get the complete package out of another car. Including the harness, throttle body, sensors, etc., etc... Than trying to find all the missing pieces to put on a crate motor.

[Bliggida]

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Ike:
you "could" but who really would?
Besides that $200/year pails in comparison to the insurance premium ~$1200/year. But you could bypass that one by not telling your insurance company. However, I much prefer to stay legal.<hr></blockquote>
People, it is NOT illegal to modify your car.

An engine replacement is a modification. There is no rule book that says you can do anything you want except put a V8 in your car. You don't ever have to tell the insurance company jack-poo!
If the car gets in a wreck bad enough to need an engine replacement - you really don't have to worry about the insurance company not paying for your LS1 since the whole car is more than likely going to be totaled too.

What's the difference between two cars that weight the exact same, same gearing, everything. One car has a supercharged V6 making 300 RWHP, the other has a stock LS1 making 300 RWHP.

Which one is more dangerous?

You can do anything you want to your car including replacing the engine and so long as it meets D.O.T. and Smog requirements its legal. Insurance companies are private businesses - not the police. They can't dictate what is illegal and what isn't.

[navigatorbob]

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Ike:
you "could" but who really would?
Besides that $200/year pails in comparison to the insurance premium ~$1200/year. But you could bypass that one by not telling your insurance company. However, I much prefer to stay legal.<hr></blockquote>

In this context, Ike is right. swapping in a v8 into a v6 camaro and not telling your insurance company about it is insurance fraud. Why? They agreed to cover you for a v6 camaro when in fact you're driving v8 camaro. You're in breech of contract. In California at least that is both a civil and a criminal violation. Will you go to jail for it? No. But if you get into a bad accident and they find out about the v8 swap, they'll cancel your policy in a heartbeart, leaving you an uninsured motorist.

Just something to chew on. And I'd go with the super-charger. A super-charged v6 rates higher my on cool-factor meter then an N/A'd v8.

[nino]

i have seen a swap done for 6 Gs - that was including labor. i never did get a chacnce to see how much i was going to get charged for it, but my mechanic estimated 1-1.5 large. but that was to include switching over to a M6 from an A4 as well.

[Bliggida]

That completely depends on what insurance company you are with.
How would they find out? You think Joe-Schmo Insurance Investigator is going to tell the differance between a mangled 3.8 Liter and a mangled LS1??? No. Unless the car makes it to the repair shop and they say, "oh you need a waterpump" You simply tell the shop not to write it down, you'll get your own. They'll fix paint, body, mechanics not relating to powertrain. That's that.

If you really want to be technical, Insurance can claim any modification done to your V6 to make it faster than what the insurance company has insured you for as a breech of contract.

Insurance will do the same thing for a 300 horsepower supercharged V6 as they will a stock LS1. If you tell them what you've done they are going to say you can't do it and you're in violation.

But, truth is, they cannot drop you for any reason. They have to abide by their own rules. They would first have to prove the wreck was directly caused by your having swapped a V8 into the car. What if you were parked in a lot and some drunk smashes into you..."Oh my gosh you had a V8 in there, we are not going to cover you"
BULL$&!#

Oh and to get the same performance out of a Supercharged V6 as a stock LS1, you are going to spend the same amount of money. The only 10lb. capable kit right now is the one from Mach Performance. And its selling beta testers at 4,XXX dollars.

I could have every part...every single little part that is required for a complete swap for less than 4,000. And that is not only including the LS1, but also the transmission with it!