Hey Tiago

[fred slawson]

Congrats on the dyno. You don't suppose you ran out of fuel instead of compressor? I can imagine with your free flowing stuff your 10psi would be a whole lot higher on a stock 3.4, just an observation. Once again congrats to you!

[Tiago]

I don't know if it did run out of fuel, I kinda doubt it , but Im not sure. I wish I had a damn fuel pressure gage......

[xjarayax]

Dyno wasn't reading A/R ratios? That sucks :(

My FMU is adjustable and there's no real way to tell what the ratio is, unless I get it up on a dyno and have them tune it for A/F after I get the setup running.

[fred slawson]

Just curious what have you done to upgrade your fuel systen.

[Tiago]

have lt1 injectors 24lb, holley AFPR, and walbro intank pump 255 lph hp.

[fred slawson]

Come my brother let us reason together. Your'e making 336hp at the rear wheels. If you say you have a 15% power train loss that means your making 380hp at the . Then you are 100 more horsepower than a stock lt1 with 25% less fuel capacity ( 6 injectors instead of 8). I know you have a bigger pump, but do you really think you got enough fuel. I just have to think you got alot more ponies in that little beastie is all. to see you dog it off when you might get alot more power out of it. Just some food for thought.

[Arctc Wolf]

Tiago isn't one to give away all his tricks. You have to also take into account that the engine bleeds off less power than an LT1 since there's only six of everything instead of 8. Also, doin his heads, exhaust, and basically making it mroe efficient is what helps him make more power. He's lowered his BSFC by doing heads, cam, exhaust, ect. The turbo also lowers the bsfc if set up right. Lowering the bsfc means that he needs less fuel to make the same amount of power.

[fred slawson]

Artic Wolfe what you say is true to a point but not that much. I'm sorry I just don't see it.

[fred slawson]

Lets look at this another way. Assuming Tiagos 380hp, that would be roughly 63.5hp per cylinder. In a V8 that is 63.5X 8= 503hp. Do you think the LT1 could do that on stock injectors, I have a hard time accepting that. NO Disrespect intended.

[Tiago]

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by fred slawson:
Lets look at this another way. Assuming Tiagos 380hp, that would be roughly 63.5hp per cylinder. In a V8 that is 63.5X 8= 503hp. Do you think the LT1 could do that on stock injectors, I have a hard time accepting that. NO Disrespect intended.<hr></blockquote>

our stock lt1 turbo project ran 480 rwhp/480rwtq at 8 psi on stock injectors, otherwise stock lt1.


you are not taking into account hte fact that the FMU boosts fuel pressure to 100+ psi under boost so it dumps quite a bit more fuel then the injector size leads you to think.

[Tiago]

I scanned my pcm during the run, my A/f Ratio was in the 9s :eek:


so its pig rich, imagine how much more I could pull out of it if I could accurately tune the fuel system.

[fred slawson]

Ah, I didn't realize you put up that much pressure. I was assuming 70 or 80psi not 100. Didn't know the injectors could take that much pressure. Cool. I thought there would be more horses available because the torque numbers where so much higher than the horsepower figure, just didn't seem right. I bet you have another 70 hidden ponies in that thing yet at least.

[Tiago]

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by fred slawson:
Ah, I didn't realize you put up that much pressure. I was assuming 70 or 80psi not 100. Didn't know the injectors could take that much pressure. Cool. I thought there would be more horses available because the torque numbers where so much higher than the horsepower figure, just didn't seem right. I bet you have another 70 hidden ponies in that thing yet at least.<hr></blockquote>


me too
:D

[MachPerformance]

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Tiago:
I scanned my pcm during the run, my A/f Ratio was in the 9s :eek:

so its pig rich, imagine how much more I could pull out of it if I could accurately tune the fuel system.<hr></blockquote>

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Tiago:
I don't know if it did run out of fuel, I kinda doubt it , but Im not sure. I wish I had a damn fuel pressure gage......<hr></blockquote>


I didn't realize you took a snapshot of your dyno run. In your first few posts you stated that you didn't know if you were running out of fuel but now state that you were running "pig rich" 9:1 A/F ratio. You also stated that you didn't know where your fuel pressure was because you didn't have a fuel pressure gauge, but now state that you have 100 psi of fuel pressure. Also news to me is the fact that stock 0-1 volt O2 sensors have the capability and resolution to read A/F Ratios that low (9:1). Most Horiba, NTK and Bosch 0-5 volt Lambda sensors/UEGO stop reading at 10:1 A/F Ratio. Just curious as to how you're able to read the PCM and decipher that you are in fact at 9:1 A/F. What type of scanner is it? Even the GM calibrating engineers we've worked with since 1999, in their experience, state the O2 sensors can only read from 15:1 to 13.5:1 A/F with SOME reasonable accuracy. I'm just curious why you haven't done Wide-Band O2 testing with it, especially being research and development with a kit you want to sell to the public in the next month or so. Also, is Radcat going to be giving RWHP #'s for a stock vehicle. Meaning no Porting of anything and running on pump gas with no High Octane mix? He said he mixed 91 & 100+. I know you don't want to compare the two kits, but you know all these people will be. There is no stopping that. These two kits are different types of forced induction with pros & cons to each. But our job is to make sure that all the facts are stated, so not to mislead anyone. Not everyone is well educated on this subject and knows all the other differences before the kits were even put on. I think to help clarify everything to the public, you should post your A/F sheets and dyno sheets and all the mods you have done. For a couple bucks, Kinko's or other office supply stores will scan it and put it on disk for you. I'm sure someone on the board will host it for you.

Another question for you is that you state you're running 24# injectors. Stock 3800 are 22#. I know at 8-8.5psi, we are in the low to mid 90psi range. At that rate of gain, how were you able to put 16psi without injector lock-up or going lean. Even at 10psi you're walking a fine line of injector lock-up. LT-1 injectors lock-up at approximately 95psi. Just food for thought. [img]smile.gif[/img]

[Tiago]

hey I never said I KNEW I was running 100+ psi, but theoretically it should. If base FP is 40 psi and a 6:1 ratio FMU is used at 10 psi , thats 100 psi already, now what kind of fp I was actually running I have no idea.

as for the A/F ratio, I did not do a wideband on the dyno. I know the a/f ratio bacause my scanner, btw its a hand held called AUTO-XRAY, says teh A/F ratio. it said 11.6 but that is considering the stock injectors, which are 17 on the 3.4, I was just guessing that with the 24s it should be considerably richer, no way to tell really. How accurate is this reading? hell I don't know. Even 11.6 is too rich for my blood.

You have to understand I do not have a big sucessfull shop where I work from or fabricate all this or gives me a budget for this project. Everything accomplished comes out of my personal or the prototype's owner's pocket. This makes all this kinda complicated. I simply do not have the resources you do, I just do the best I can with what I can. I have good friends in the right places that can help me get what I need done, that is how I can produce these kits. At the dyno Im not wasting time at 7-8 psi, if it only ran that on mine and and radcat's first dyno, it was because we both had problems. We both had 3 inch long rips on some intake pipe connectors that owned the boost to only 7-8.0 I always plan on running big boost numbers cause Im going all the way to get everything I can out of it, thats why I usually go ready with 100+ octane. Why settle for any less, I can display what my kits are capable of. Now I can tell you radcat has ran 14 psi on 93 pump gas on the street before without incidents. But at the track or at the dyno, why settle for less then full performance? race gas and up the boost, and let it rip, tahts what its all about. Common practice by all GN, TTAs, and pretty much any turbo car out there. Now does this mean that you can't run pump gas? hell no. I run pump gas everyday on the street as does the other prototype cars at 7-10psi, but if Im gonna get numbers I will go all out and squeeze all I can out of it being as safe as I can. on 7 lbs I can run 105 mph trap speeds and I can do that on pump gas, that indicates quite a bit of power. But as I Said Im always lookinf for more out of it.