10 serious Beta testers needed for Procharger Kit.

[SkyHawk]

Batman, I'm all for the beta version. I have the money now if I wanted to but I think I'm going to wait till they release it a year down the road.

Chris

[knowledgefreak]

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by SkyHawk:
Batman, I'm all for the beta version. I have the money now if I wanted to but I think I'm going to wait till they release it a year down the road.

Chris<hr></blockquote>

skyhawk why wait bro? Ati is not going to produce the kit they are simply going to buy it from Ryan.

If you dont want forced induction now then fine, but it wont be any better when ati endorces it or not. Ryan has found a pro that builds this stuff all the time. You do not need a big companies named stamped on it to make it a good product.

Your head unit will have a warranty from ati on it and the mounting kit and intercooler is really nothing to go wrong with that.

SO why wait?

[TheBeast]

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by knowledgefreak:


skyhawk why wait bro? Ati is not going to produce the kit they are simply going to buy it from Ryan.

If you dont want forced induction now then fine, but it wont be any better when ati endorces it or not. Ryan has found a pro that builds this stuff all the time. You do not need a big companies named stamped on it to make it a good product.

Your head unit will have a warranty from ati on it and the mounting kit and intercooler is really nothing to go wrong with that.

SO why wait?<hr></blockquote>

He has a good point. I personally like the thought that I will be one of only 10 v6 fbods cruisin around with this kit for a full year. [img]smile.gif[/img] We will get a lot of attention over the U.S. at tracks when we put up some good numbers. Can you say 11 more additions to the 12/13 sec category in the next few months? ;)

So thats what....5 already paid, with a few more about to? The spots are going fast! I wonder how Bill will feel when you tell him all 10 spots are gone within a day or two. :D

[ April 10, 2002: Message edited by: TheBeast ]</p>

[Cale]

So, how many spots are left?

Damn I feel like I'm on an eBay auction, and that feeling of wanting to get a spot so you "win" ("win" AKA "drop 4k & win" :)

[BATMAN]

OKay guys... sorry i took a nap this afternoon and didn't wake up till now..


<blockquote>quote:</font><hr> Originally posted by Knowledgefreak:

[b]Im just curious about the 3000 dollars and what that is going to. If you are paying 4000 dollars for your kit and you have this extra 3000 dollars you are trying to collect are you trying to say it is going to cost 7000 dollars to make the first kit?

[QUOTE] Originally posted by Knowledgefreak:

Im just a bit confused why you would even need a deposit up front as you know you can have bill make your kit and if it works out, it can then be marketed and sold.
<hr></blockquote>

There is always someone who thinks that someone is out to rip them off.

The 300 is to gaurantee that there will be at least 10 people who want this kit after making it. Yes it is costing me more than 4195 to make the kit. A LOT MORE...a couple thousand more. 3 moderators know how much it is costing me.
ITs isn't cheap. Like i said...out of the deal I am going to loose 500 for the first 10. Doing this also gaurantees me 10 testers... that way i can get the endorsement through ATI.
I have a wife and kid. I do not plan on putting all this money into this kit and not have anyone afterwards who will want to buy it.

I am not worried about the money... i have the money to pay Bill. This is just to gaurantee at least 10 sales, and 10 testers for all the trouble and money i am putting out. I mean.. i am donating my baby for this cause.. if during testing..my engine blows up, i am the one who has to pay for it not you. So yeah... flat out.. i want to be sure its worth my while. If you think that 300.00 is too much to ask, then don't participate. But don't be sorry when I deliver what i promise. I am not one of those lil punks that come online and blurt out dreams and do a lot of talking and then never back up my words. If what our Estimates are true, then you'll be waiting a while before you can run what everyone else is running.

So far i beleive i have 4 people who have signed up... got to read these 50 messages to see if i have more


<blockquote>quote:</font><hr> Originally posted by Knowledgefreak:

If your kit fails or just does not work, or causes the car to severly run bad does that mean they do not get their 300 deposit back because a kit was made but it has bugs still?

Or are you saying you will get your money back if the alpha testing stage fails? <hr></blockquote>

The recipets that i will be mailing off will be signed and will show an agreement

1) IF a kit is not produced, you will get your $300.00 back.

2) IF a kit is produced, you will get $350 dollars off the original price of the kit. i am paying the 50.00 for a savings to You.

3) IF YOU NEVER EVER EVER buy the kit... then well yah.. your going to loose your $300.

4) IF you don't buy it right away in June cause you don't have the money, you will NOT loose your $300.00. It just means you are not buying the kit right away.


You will either get a kit that works or they will get their deposit back. The money will be returned if the kit does not work - which i highly doubt. Bill has been making kits for a long time and is a forced induction specialist. I am not having no mom and pop, down the street shop do this. THAT is why its costing me so much.


<blockquote>quote:</font><hr> Originally posted by Knowledgefreak:

Just as anyone can find a good race shop and have a mounting kit made, it is not rocket science.
<hr></blockquote>

If you think its that easy, call a couple shops and see what they tell you. I promise you that either they will say

1) NO we don't do that
2) There is not enough of a market for the V6
3) Bend over and pay up.

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr> Originally posted by Knowledgefreak:

I know your a business man but you may really want to consider your profit margin a bit more if you want to move these things. <hr></blockquote>


Damn right i am a business man...AGAIN...you think i am going to spend all this money and not have anyone to buy this when its done?

Like someone said earlier... go online and see wht the cost of an ATI kit is... you'll find that the p600b kit is cheap now because ATI released the P-1SC. HOWEVER Check out the prices for the P-1SC kits.

And do you think when they made those kits, that someone went through all the trouble i am going through?

Do you think that their kit comes with PCM tuning?

Do you think that they are using Manderl bent pipes except for connectors?

Do you think that it comes with a 3 core intercooler made to fit for you car?

Do you think it comes with fuel regulators and FMU that is made to controll fuel for your car?

Do you think its going to come with an install guide that a 10 yr old can understand?

I don't think so...we are putting a lot of effort into this that most kits don't come with and it is going to be made with quality parts. When it is done, you won't be embarrased to open your hood.


<blockquote>quote:</font><hr> Originally posted by Knowledgefreak:

For 4000 dollars it would be just as easy to drop in an ls1 and new tranny and still have more ponies to the retires than this kit on a v6.

Just have to look at that because I would really like to see more affordable v6 power adders out there and les "rksport" type shops. <hr></blockquote>

Yeah but then it wouldn't be a V6 anymore will it? And whats to say your car will ever run the same again after an engine swap? At least if the charger doesn't work, you can take it off and you car will run like it did before.

If all you want is power, and you can find someone that will do an engine swap for you for $4000.00 parts and labor... then by all means what are you doing here on this board? Go do the swap and hang out on the V8 boards.

Sorry didn't mean to sound rude, but i have done some research into the engine swap and its no walk in the park... and it isn't $4000.00.

As far as the Rksport comment, I'm a little hurt.
If you think you can make a kit cheaper, by all means go ahead and try. I promise by the time you are done, you will wish you had charged more. I think for what i am promising to deliver, that the price i have quoted is more than fair.

Okay i am off to read the rest of this thread....

OKAY i just read the thread and i have a lot more to talk about! THANK YOU KNOWLEDGEFREAK LOL!!! [img]graemlins/dunce.gif[/img]

Guys.. come on.. give me a lil credit here. You think i am going to run away with the money? HOW Long have you guys known me?

OKay FIRST OFF... thank you Steve for answering the questions while my *** was sleeping. Seriously guys i took a nap when i got home, and i didn't wake up till now: 4:00AM!!!! THANK GOD you were online Steve.


<blockquote>quote:</font><hr> Originally posted by Knowledgefreak:

Why does it matter if the kit is endorsed by ati or not? The head unit can be purchased from ati and the kit purchased from ryan. So what good does it do the buyer if it is endorsed by ati or not? Or does this simply benefit the future sales of the actual kit? <hr></blockquote>
Like i said... i could have finished the p600B kit...and saved a couple thousand. However i don't know if i would ever get ATI's endorsement or be able to mass produse it for everyone... all i really would have been able to do is tell you where to get the pieces and what to buy and then have instructions to put it together. I wouldn't have been able to give you guys a waranty and i wouldn't be able to gaurantee that it would work.Going this route, we are finally going to have a REAL kit for the 3.8 instead of an adapatation.

First off, We are using ATI's head unit. If we had made our own head unit things would be different, But we are not. ITs one thing to make a custom kit for yourself using their unit. Its another thing to make a kit and then sell it using their head unit.

If something goes wrong, ATI is involved whether they want to be or not.

Hypothetically, Lets say i did make the kit on my own... like the p600B kit... You put it on, and your engine is running fine, and you add a couple more mods to the car. One of those mods lets say inadvertantly causes your engine to catch fire and lets say your car blows up. So you decide to sue everyone's *** for damanges cause you think its the ATI charger that did it.
Next thing you know, your lawyer has talked you into sueing me, and sueing ati. Ati comes back and says? WHAT? we didn't release a kit for the 3.8... what the heck? Next thing you know.. ATI is suing my ***. Ummm sorry... again i have a wife and a kid...and i do not want that to ever ever ever happen.

NOW... thats just my concern. When Bill first made the kit for the S10... ATI put a stop to it. Bill had to meet with the CEO and wait a whole year before he could realease the kit. ATI tested it for a whole year. Now... because Bill already has their confidence and because he is an authorised distributor, going through him will only make life easier for me. I will be able to realese WITH THE BLESSING OF ATI at least 10 kits to the market for testing. Once the 10 testers run for a year, We will be able to release it with ATI's endorsement- meaning-
okay bud, we've tested your system, its worthy to be sold, and we give you our blessing to sell it to the general public. Here is a 3 yr warranty if anything happens.

You want a solid kit? or do you just want me to make a kit and sell it to you and say good luck?

For $4195.00 you better hope that you are getting what you paid for and THAT is what i am making sure.


<blockquote>quote:</font><hr> Originally posted by Knowledgefreak:

When the kit is ready for beta testing will it be at a point where all bugs have been worked out of the system? Or will people be stuck with problems?
<hr></blockquote>

YES...all bugs will be worked out with my car.

All the 10 beta testers are going to do is install it and a year from now tell me that they love their kit and have had no problems. I mean initially there may be problems just from errors in installation or something not connected the right way. However I am not going to make a kit and give it to 10 people without testing it. ARE YOU CRAZY???? Like i want to drive all over the world to fix bugs. Sorry, thats not my idea of fun. I am donating my car to be blown up or whatever it takes to get a solid working kit so that all you have to do is slap it on and have fun. If for some reason i have to go out of town to help a beta tester, i will. However i am going to minimize that possiblity as much as i can.


<blockquote>quote:</font><hr> Originally posted by Knowledgefreak:

How will fixes be made for people out of state if there is a detonation problem or any other type of problem occuring?
<hr></blockquote>

I have been in support business for many years. I guess initially a support call would be through the phone. We would make sure everything is connected correclty and go from there.

If that doesn't work, looks like Ryan will be making some road trips on a weekend.

HOWEVER. like i said, i plan on testing the kits thoroughly before I give it to the 10 beta testers. Unless they have a problem installing it, The kit should not cause any problems once it is installed.

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr> Originally posted by Knowledgefreak:

How certain can you be that this will be done all in a few short months and be functional? You expect the first kit to be done by the end of may but with all the bugs worked out by june?
<hr></blockquote>


Yep thats what i am hoping for, but like i said in my original post...its an expected schedule. THings happen, i can't predict the future, if it takes longer, it may take longer. That does several things

1) it gives the beta tester a lil longer to save up money

2) it means that i am making sure the kit is solid with bugs worked out

3) It means that people are going to get what they paid for.

If for some reason, my car blows up, or i can't finish this kit, then the beta testers will get their 300.00 back.

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr> Originally posted by Knowledgefreak:

Will it come with additional fuel pump, boost guages, what specific type of pcm tuning?
<hr></blockquote>

Okay gauges were mentioned in the discussion i had with Bill. I will make sure that it is included in the kit. As far as fuel it is going to run on premium. You ask about an additional fuel pump but who is to say you need one? He has a custom fuel regulator and FMU. I beleive he has fuel covered. If we need a pump, i will let you know when we cross that road.

PCM tuning, well that is one that i am going to have to ask BIll more details about. I have the same questions as you do about that. I want to be sure it will be easy for people out of state to do. Don't worry i will have answers for this before the end of the week.


I AM NOT OUT TO SCREW ANYONE HERE please keep that in mind. I am putting a lot of effort, time, and money... and frankly my wife is even upset at the time i put in, but i am making a whole lof of sacrifices for the better good. I don't want any praise for what i am doing. It is God who gives me strength and finance for what i am doing. Give him the credit.


P.S Knowledgefreak...or anyone else that responded to his post, if i have answered all your questions, -and i hope they have been satisfactory- Please delete your posts from this thread and discuss this in the lounge. I will be okay with that as long as It doesn't become a flame war. I will be forced to lock it IF it does.

I want to keep this thread purely proffesional and i want to be able to look through it and be able to tell who is making a deposit and who is not, without having to read through discussions about why or why not i should be doing it this way.

Trust me if you knew how much i am paying, and knew what i am about to do with my car, you would wonder why i am not asking for more than 300.00.

[ April 10, 2002: Message edited by: BATMAN ]</p>

[BATMAN]

OKay here is the latest total:

payments through PAYPAL:

TheBeast (Waiting for Pay Pal verification)

Silver2000V6 (i added my hotmail address to pay pal you should be albe to send it to me okay now)

oxbld (cleared and paid)

John_D (waitng for PAY PAL verification)


Payments in the mail with M.O.

mike24

People who have said they will send me money

FirebirdGT

W68Firebird97

So far seven... if I have forgotten anyone please let me know.

IF everyone so far follows through, there are
only 3 kits left


Side bar: SkyHawk if you want to wait.. its up to you. Just wondering why you are waiting. IF you have any questions, let me know.

[ April 10, 2002: Message edited by: BATMAN ]</p>

[BATMAN]

Well in an effort to answer all of Knowledgefreak's questions.. i forgot to answer everyone elses.


<blockquote>quote:</font><hr> Oringinally posted by SFfirebird:

batman, i really need to know the answers to my questions..read above. if u answer them then i will prolly be on your list because i have the money ready, i just need to know what will happen if something goes wrong when i get the car back, will there be some sort of warranty or? and do we need to drive our cars down to kansas city or? <hr></blockquote>

This has been answered in my previous posts


<blockquote>quote:</font><hr> Oringinally posted by SFfirebird:

how long to instal the supercharger..and just how detailed are these instructions because I am very very very basic when it comes to instaling things..and i dont have any jacks or anythign for my car i have plenty of tools but thats it
<hr></blockquote>

Again, the instructions will be easy to understand. I am very familiar with documentationa and i am damn good at it to so it will be easy to read. IT will include a list of tools you will need to do the install.


<blockquote>quote:</font><hr> Oringinally posted by TheBeast:


I've got full 3" exhaust including the cat...I have the stock '99 manifolds right now, but am going to swap some ported '00+ tubular manifolds in there. Think that will be sufficient?
<hr></blockquote>

As far as exhaust goes, i will find out from Bill exactly what the requirements are. Considering I have 3" exhaust (see my post early about my exhaust setup), i would assume you guys may need to invest a little in an exhaust setup. In any case, when going with forced induction, you will want to go with a larger exhaust setup anyways. I did my exhaust setup knowing that i would one day put a charger on my car.
<blockquote>quote:</font><hr> Oringinally posted by 94-3.4:


My heart is pounding in anticipation.
Will this kit be for 95-02 or just the newer 3800 w/ straight intake?
<hr></blockquote>

It will work for both. I have a friend here locally who has a camaro with the angled intake. I will be able to kill two birds with one stone (no pun intended). I can make sure the kit fits on a camaro as well as the angled intake.

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr> Oringinally posted by
Rich97 W68:
Injectors?
Anyone talked about injectors for this kit yet?[/b] <hr></blockquote>

Like i said i will cross that road when it comes. If we need it, we will get it...

Anymore questions??

[veesix]

ok I have a ?

what about the 1996 3800 computer tuning? can he tune my comp in my 96. If he can do that then he could also market custom computer tuning for the 96, which no one else offers. If he can't the next best thing would be the MAFT+ right? so If I need to get the maft+ would this bring down the price of the kit because he is not doing custom programming? Thanks for your time batman!

[daWhoady]

also...in addition to veesix's question, would Bill sell the custom fuel regulators and FMU for other forced induction projects and cars?

[SkyHawk]

Batman will mods like the Whisper Lid and SLP cold air induction and Jet Performance module work with the SC or will they have to be ditched?

Chris

[ April 10, 2002: Message edited by: SkyHawk ]</p>

[John_D.]

Well, besides the $300 deposit, I just ordered the CIA headers, Borla V8 catback, and an Autotap, so I just keep getting in deeper and deeper!!! Like a kid in a candy store as they say.

Batman, and everyone else who has been involved in pioneering, and in getting a kit put together, thanks for all your work on this, it is very much appreciated.

Thanks to the folks (Shirl, and others) who gave me all the exhaust advice three or four months ago when I first found this board, when I was searching for someplace with supercharger solutions.

Thanks in an indirect way to the person who replied, but would not answer, my PCV question early on, because I went back and pondered on the issue some more and came up with a pretty effective and easy to implement solution. I'll share more about it later, after I see how the kit has addressed it...

[94CaliCamaro]

Batman, forgive me for being overanxious, but when can us 3.4 people expect something similar, any estimate on time? Is it gonna work pretty much the same way it's going now($300 deposit)? Any idea if the 3.4 will be any cheaper or more expensive? I can't wait to slap one of these babies on my car. So when it's time to sell the SC for the 3.4 count me in(waiving $300 deposit)!! [img]graemlins/fluffy.gif[/img]

Thanks,

Davy Dave

[FirebirdGT]

Locking this thread, refer to this new one:

http://www.camarov6.com/cgi-bin/ulti...c&f=4&t=000449


BTW, I'm still in as A Beta.