A thought about "turbo fever"

[Tiago]

noone said it was about me.

I just think your stupid uncalled whoring comments are irrelevant.

[ February 23, 2004, 06:37 PM: Message edited by: Tiago ]

[hawgs]

You mean irrelevant.

[Tiago]

u should go back and edit your post, sounded like you have a chip on your shoulder.

don't start the spelling bs heh
But I'll go ahead and edit that to make your life that much easier.

[hawgs]

PM for you Tiago.

[Arctc Wolf]

U all need 2 grow up. omg, what is the point of all this? just so ppl can act like drama queens? we now have 2 1/2 pages of fighting back and forth about some stupid stuff. matt, tiago, speed, if drone doesn't believe ur numbers, then he doesn't have 2. drone, u need 2 stop reitterating urself over and over about how u don't like or trust matt, tiago, or speed, cuz that's all I got outa that last set of comments back and forth.

as far as the QMP kit is concerned, sure numbers sell kits, but those numbers don't matter at all unless ur running the same fuel as they did. I understand the thing about the composite manifold swap. I was just bringing that u because of what stefan said about the motor not being stock.

I think that The few of us who actually speak from a logical standpoint should continue this discussion elsewhere, and this post should be closed up, just because it's gotten out of hand at this point. What do u think Stefan?

[mattsv6]

why the hell would he lock this thread? HE STARTED IT!!!

[Arctc Wolf]

he'd lock it because I doubt he thought things would go this far or create this much drama.

[HAZ-Matt]

For what it is worth, here are the 3.8L turbo times I have found...

Radcat 14.3 @ 99mph at 7psi, M5

xjarayax 14.3 @ 97 at 7 psi, A4 (non intercooled)

Wicked 3800 V6 14.362 @ 98.29 at 7psi, M5 (non intercooled)

Shane 12.69 @ 106 at 8psi, A4/Converter

Everyone except for Shane had serious problems when they ran their cars...

EDITED... Looks like half of them were not intercooled.

What would the times be for a car running a Procharger at 7-8psi?

[ February 24, 2004, 01:25 PM: Message edited by: HAZ-Matt ]

[HAZ-Matt]

To try and get back on topic...

We are once again talking about Superchargers v Turbos in the FI forum. [Gomer Pyle]Surprise surprise surprise[/Gomer Pyle]... But really we are talking about centrifugal superchargers and the difference between crank driven (ATI, Vortech, Powerdyne) and exhaust turbine driven (turbos) CSC's.

What I am going to be posting next I am largely copying from an article you can find at
Automotive Forums

[Centrifugal superchargers don't] have a realiable airflow amount based on any RPM, because it’s very design only flows air efficiently at high RPM. Crank driven centrifugal compressors generally operate around 60,000 RPM maximum, while turbocharger compressors can exceed 120,000 RPM. So although these compressors are very efficient at high RPM, they are largely innefective at creating meaningful boost at lower RPM. This concept is called surge limit, and measures the airflow rate of the compressor into a pressurized path vs. its RPM. If you’ve ever seen a compressor map for a turbocharger, that upper line extending across the turbo’s efficiency area is this concept in action. It’s at that point in the airflow vs. pressure scale where the compressor can no longer flow air into the system.

The pros of using a centrifugal compressor include…
-very high adiabatic efficiency levels over large flow rates
-low levels of parasitic drag vs. boost produced
-many different sizes available to precisely match engine’s airflow needs
-light weight and small design make fitment easy
-ease of fitment makes intercooling very easy to add

The cons of using a centrifugal compressor include …
-high compressor RPM means lower long term reliability
-high compressor RPM means internal tolerances must be very exacting
-inability to be driven at high RPM during low speed engine operation make boost available only at moderate RPM (though there are ways around this)
-no simple way to control boost levels on crank driven designs, limiting compressor RPM vs. engine RPM choices (thus compromising boost response)

Essentially the removal of that last con is what makes a turbo "better" than a crank driven centrifugal supercharger.

Of course, ease of installation clearly goes to the crank driven supercharger... and some may feel that the linear response is more predictable, while others feel that the reduced stress on the engine at low rpm is makes crank driven csc's superior.

[Justin Kirkham]

Again, I think it depends upon the weak points and the strong points of the car/engine. Our cars have good low down power but need help up high... that is why I want a turbo. If I owned an import, I would go for a supercharger, because they need torque! I don't think that any power adder is better than any other on any car... for ours cars, and most domestics, I think that turbos are the best way to go.

-Justin

[Shirl]

Wow...everyone needs to take a chill pill [img]graemlins/wavey.gif[/img] Tiago, in no way did I mean to offend you..sorry if I did. You're car runs very strong for a 3.4 and I think that's what people forget. Hello...the 3.4 came with a mere 160 hp and he is dynoing 340!!! More than double [img]graemlins/bowdown.gif[/img] Anyway, can't we all stop doing this: [img]graemlins/twak.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/stickpoke.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/slap.gif[/img] and do this: [img]graemlins/wavey.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/love.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/burnout.gif[/img]

[ February 23, 2004, 09:55 PM: Message edited by: Shirl ]

[mattsv6]

this thread was started by the founder of the website too start bs. that is my opinion and i think it should be a sticky. anything non-car related should be deleted. the rest is relevant and should be up here.

[hou-tex-six]

Originally posted by Drone51:
Just think its stupid when people try to talk **** about other peoples stuff when they cant even back it up with their own stuff.

STOP BENCH RACING AND RUN A NUMBER.

I am the only one that sees the insane amounts of hypocracy and irony here? You dont have anything Jason, just zip it man. If you really think you have the capacity to build something better then get out there and do it.

Fact of the matter is you dont know a damn thing about Tiagos car/turbo. I dont even know that much about it and I helped build it, and rebuild it, and modify it, etc etc... and I dont even know that much about it.

And by the way, the saying is Money (or times) TALKS, Bull**** WALKS. Once again your spite makes you say stupid things that make you look like even more of an ***.

Cp

[Wicked 3800 V6]

HazMatt, I was (am still) non-intercooled on that run.

[Tyler]

to each their freak'n own... damn...

how about that ay?

you'll never convince a supercharge lover to like turbo's... and you'll never convince a turbo lover to like superchargers..

we are beating a dead horse here.


oh, and james.. i know your just bust'n their chops. But i got the best mod anyone can ever think of... yep. thats right.

my girlfriend is getting the silicon injection mod.. booooya