Powerdyne Rant

[Shirl]

That diagram is not even close to being correct! And my freakin' scanner isn't working right, so right now I can't even scan in the correct diagram.. :mad: Someone help me out here :(

[Mighty Thor]

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by camaro_speedemon:


You mean Stefans kit is copying the PD setup? He's using a dual belt design.

http://www.projectvirus.com/supercha...beltmaster.jpg

I just don't like the way the PD is designed. It hardly gets any belt coverage around the pulley, which is why it has the slipping problem in the first place. And if the belt is slipping, its causing friction. And friction creates heat, heat leads to premature wear.


The PD also doesn't have an intercooler. That's all fine and dandy for low boost, but anything passed 9PSI is dangerous. Someone even said that 9PSI won't even make much of a difference on the PD, that's because it's non-intercooled. Intercooled boost is MUCH better, especially in high boost conditions. It's not unheard of to gain 40HP just by running an intercooler.

The PD is good if you're looking to run and stay at 6PSI. If you want to go higher,IMO your waisting your money. It's good for what it is, a low boost blower.

I think that once Batmans kit gets to the beta testers and they get dynoed, it will be making a lot more power than what Batman was putting down. IIR he had a pretty weak motor to begin with and was putting down the same numbers as the PD. And if the beta testers report back the same numbers, then I'll give a lot more props the PD.<hr></blockquote>

[img]graemlins/thumbsdown.gif[/img] I sure am glad that they said the diagram is all wrong. The history of the Virus started off as copying the Powerdyne set up. But Stephan found out it does work to well for the ATI because it is gear driven and that's hard to spin, so it slips alot. But he later on got the double belt for it. Which is awesome.

As far as intercooler, it is possible. I've seen an S10 with an intercooler and he dynoed well over 350 rwhp on the stock engine. I posted this once along with his site. I guess it's not up anymore.

I had water/alcohol injection and that was great. I had it removed because I was bogging down on it and plus I had to smog my car and I ended up breaking it when I was removing it. Long Story...

As far as the dynoed numbers. Check out the article above about Vector Performance. The camaro made well over 250 rwhp on 8psi non intercooled. That is the only mod that is done to that car. It doesn't even have an exhaust done to it, talk about an awesome number. I saw this car 5 years ago before he shipped it to Florida. .

So yeah, its great that there are other kits coming out,better than the PD in some ways. But Powerdyne is still worth mentioning and the RESPECT for being the first.

[imported_admin]

That belt diagram has now been deleted (I could have sworn I took that offline months ago).

The reason it was incorrect is because when we were asking POWERDYNE OWNERE HERE THIS SPRING for information, that is what a supposed Powerdyne owner provided. Shirl, Mighty Thor, and several other Powerdyne owners simply did not reply when we were asking questions for comparison reasons. We posted SEVERAL TIMES as we were installing Pathogen's supercharger in May. We received one response.

Maybe if you Powerdyne owners actually PROVIDED INFORMATION then there wouldn't be so much disinformation out there. How the f was I supposed to know if the diagram was correct when a Powerdyne owner said "yeah, that's fine"?

Okay, you want a rant?

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by 98GREENGLOW:
The kit has proven on two dyno's that I know of to produce 260 rwhp at 8 psi.<hr></blockquote>

Wow. Two dynos. The kit has been sold for over five years... we have over a dozen members with it. There are probably at least 50-100 of the units that have been sold since it has begun.

AND ONLY TWO HAVE PROVIDED INFORMATION! [img]graemlins/thumbsdown.gif[/img] Everyone else provided excuses, saying their belt was slipping, they didn't get around to going to the track, yada yada.

I generally have a policy of keeping my mouth shut when discussions of the Powerdyne vs. real superchargers go around... but get real.

If your Powerdyne is so great, why are you running in the 15's?!? Why did Shirl only hit 13.9 with the blower alone? Why are the only two other entries on the Timeslips Page in the 14's? It took a hefty shot of nitrous to get Shirl into the 12's. If the Powerdyne is so great, why can't she hit it with just that? Why depend on nitrous?

If this belt slip issue can be truly fixed then the Powerdyne is a good setup. But it is just that--good. Not fantastic, not worth $3500. Makes the car peppy--but still does not hold a candle to a stock LS1. Sorry, but for that amount of money, you'd better be going a lot faster than 13.9. And it's limited.

So, in the face of better alternatives (either a twin-belt ATI, BATMAN's single-belt ATI, or Tiago's turbo), why bother? Why waste your time and money with something that is limited to 9-10 psi (reliability reasons), non-intercooled, and 13.9?

A good centrifugal supercharger setup (i.e. mine/Pathogen's and hopefully BATMAN's) is upgradeable and can keep up with your car when you want more than what the kit offers right out of the box. It should at least put you in the low 13's @ 110+ mph at 10 psi. Heck, with an intercooler, why stop there? I ran 12 psi on stock internals... no problems... 13.2. Not 12's in my ET so I kept my mouth shut, no, but that will come if I ever decide to get into racing again.

[98GREENGLOW]

I agree with you in some ways. 13.9 to me is outstanding but then again if you want to grow and build up your internals then the powerdyne would not be the wise decision. Really it's only good for 11 psi and thats pushin it. How much boost can the ATI kit handle? I would never tell anyone to go and spend 3-5 grand for the powerdyne or any other FI personaly (except for maybe the turbo for 3500) But I think a USED powerdyne is a good deal. On my 18's my best with the powerdyne was a 16.4 . Now my best on the 18's with the powerdyne is a 15.1. I dropped 1.3 seconds . I know that the new ststems coming out may totaly blow away the time dropp I got, but I inly paid 2200 $ to drop that 1.3 seconds. That is why I support the powerdyne. Because most of us could save up two grand and get a used powerdyne and go from running a 15.7 to a 14.4. Are those great numbers... NO. But is that more power than you can get for our camaro than anything else you would spend two grand on...I BELEAVE so. That's all Im trying to say. I dont know much about your kit, but I will say that if it's only 3 grand and will drop you 1 -1/2 through 2 full seconds then it is defiently worth getting over the powerdynes 1 -1 1/2 seconds for two grand. However if Batmans kit cost 4 grand (good luck finding a used one) and a used powerdyne goes for two grand , but people are only running 4 tenths quicker on batmans kit thaen the powerdyne, Is it worth the money? Thats up to the individual. Yes hypotheticaly speaking Id rather hit 13.5 with Batmans kit than 14 flat with the powerdyne. But even more than that Id rather pocket 2 grand.

[camaro_speedemon]

Don't quote me, but a procharger IIR should be able to handle something like 18PSI I think....

[imported_admin]

Procharger P600B 27 psi
Procharger P1SC 32 psi
Vortech S or T Trim 27+ psi

Basically, your engine will blow up long before the supercharger does (at least with excessive boost as a root cause).

But is buying a used supercharger wise? I'm curious about people's feelings on this, going to start a new thread...

[Shirl]

If your Powerdyne is so great, why are you running in the 15's?!? Why did Shirl only hit 13.9 with the blower alone? Why are the only two other entries on the Timeslips Page in the 14's? It took a hefty shot of nitrous to get Shirl into the 12's. If the Powerdyne is so great, why can't she hit it with just that? Why depend on nitrous?

If the ATI is "so great" than why have you NEVER posted a timeslip?? Why is your car called "Project Virus"? LOL, had to get you back for that one..
I didn't think I would have to answer the obvious question about adding nitrous but I will: nitrous is a nice alternative to an intercooler.
And my motor is ENTIRELY STOCK and the car has a Full interior; not gutted. As I said before, tuning has been an issue for me, as my car runs extremely rich. So rich in fact, that I foul plugs. With Autotap, I am working on that and will post new best ETs once the bugs are worked out. My 12.6 at over 110 mph was with misfires in 2 cylinders.

If this belt slip issue can be truly fixed then the Powerdyne is a good setup. But it is just that--good. Not fantastic, not worth $3500. Makes the car peppy--but still does not hold a candle to a stock LS1. Sorry, but for that amount of money, you'd better be going a lot faster than 13.9. And it's limited.

Although the Powerdyne may be limited to 9psi, it certainly has proven itself as a reliable kit. And water injection or an intercooler can be installed just like on the other prototype kits.

[Mighty Thor]

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Shirl:
[b]

Although the Powerdyne may be limited to 9psi, it certainly has proven itself as a reliable kit. And water injection or an intercooler can be installed just like on the other prototype kits.<hr></blockquote>

Water/Alcohol injection here. The system is awesome with it. Mine is broke right now.

When I bought the Powerdyne, I knew it was limited to 9psi. That point is, it advertises itself correctly and it gives dyno proven results. If its really false in advertising, then call it whatever you want.

There are S10 and Mustangs racing with the PD on and doing awesome with it.

But Powerdyne has proven itself among our members. And those who had it or have it now are not at all disappointed, as a matter of fact they appreciate it.

It is understandable if they update to Turbo or ATI because they want over 15psi with a strenghten block.

Shirl's combo of Powerdyne and N2O is awesome, that in itself is an upgrade. Power constantly and more power at the push of the botton. That's why I want to be like Shirl.

[Shirl]

But Powerdyne has proven itself among our members. And those who had it or have it now
are not at all disappointed, as a matter of fact they appreciate it.


I agree. We have both had our kits for at least 6 years. It is PROVEN to work. I have had 0 problems with it. Is there another kit at this time that is mass produced? no. Will there be another? eventually. Every car with forced induction will have it's issues. For those of you who are not familiar with this type of modification, don't let anyone sugarcoat things with numbers and tell you it's an easy install. Nothing is easy. And every car is different in terms of performance and the type of tuning it will need. The thing that bothers me the most is the heat that Greenglow gets for asking questions and posting some of his problems. There are many people who don't give advice at all. They just criticize and try to degrade him. These people have no modifications done or are not even familiar with the Powerdyne system or forced induction in general. As someone has in their sig: "Be part of the solution, not part of the problem". And MT, thanks for the compliment! I really do appreciate it. [img]graemlins/love.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/burnout.gif[/img]