...Yet another m90 question

[ReD715]

I currently own a 99 GTP and I am a former owner of a 95 Firebird. I miss the ttops, manual transmission, and last but not least, the rwd. My L67 is a lot faster then the 3.4 that was in the Firebird but not quite as fun to drive. I would like to own another 4th gen Fbody in the near future (2-3 years). Right now I am just doing some reseach on doing the full L67 swap, not top end. Yes I know that it will not be cheap to do this swap but the Firebird will just be a project/weekend car, so money/time is not important. I have a few questions that my search did not answer or I couldnt find.....

-How strong is the manual transmission? How strong is the automatic?
-How much horsepower can either hold until it needs to be strengthened?
-Has anyone swapped in the L67 block and mated it to the tranny successfully? Can it be done or are there any problems?
-Are there any hood problems on a 98+ car with the blower snout hitting it? The only problem I heard was the cowl.
-Has anyone run a top end m90 swaped stock car at the track yet?

ZZP put their m90 kit on an GT (L36) and it put down 253fwhp with only CAI, ubend/cat/resonator delete, which should be running mid to high 13s with that.

I already know about the Holden m90 being the best option for having the m90 swap. Its just too bad that the Gen V m90 wont fit because of its size which is about the size of a Gen III m90 with a TB.

The reason for doing the full out L67 swap is for a couple reasons of compression and already being built. Boosted cars like lower compression and KR is more dramatic. If an L36 had lets say 4*KR, that would equal around 10*KR on an L67. Since the engine is all put together, I would have everything needed. It would be easier stripping it to the block and then putting heads, manifold, and supercharger on. I have a DHP Powrtuner so tuning it wont be a problem.

Well thats all I have for questions now, but now Im off to research the headers for the car and see if they can be done......

[Shodown]

Re: ...Yet another m90 question

Honestly, I would buy another f-body, get a Powerdyne kit, put a smaller pulley on for 9-10 psi, meth injection and the of course CAI/headers/injectors etc.

That will make more power for a HE11 of alot cheaper. Plus I highly doubt that m90 sc will fit under our hoods without a ton of fabrication and headache. I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure.

Just my 2 cents. :)

[Mighty Thor]

Re: ...Yet another m90 question

Go buy Hi. Perf. Pontiac. There's an article there about how a TA could have been a blown 3.8 V6. Very interesting read with some pictures of the set up.

Other than that, it's not an impossible thing to do.

[ReD715]

Re: ...Yet another m90 question

I am not interested in the Powerdyne setup, I will look at that later though. So prices for that I dont know yet. This is what I figure.....

600-1000 for complete L67 via Ed Morad
150-200 for gaskets
800-1200 for Holden m90
----------
1550-2200 Total

I could sell the L36 as a whole or part that out for 600-800 and sell the US m90 for 150-300.

Buying new stuff (1550-2200) subtracting the stuff I sell (750-1100) =$800-$1100. This is is the general idea I had in mind, I know it will not work out to this price but It could work out better or worse (leaning towards worse for expected error).

Labor will be done by myself and a friend of mine. So all it was cost is beverages.

Also maybe a new torque converter right?

EDIT - I also forgot about the TB. So that will bump the price a bit

[iGoRa]

Re: ...Yet another m90 question

go ahead and try , and keep your eye on Powerdyne just in case ;)

[Fbody3400]

Re: ...Yet another m90 question

go ahead and try , and keep your eye on Powerdyne just in case ;)

Issues will arise. Do you remember how far back your 3.4 sat in the engine bay? Its the same for a 3.8. Now, imagine sticking a supercharger on top of that, doesn't really fit, does it?

[ReD715]

Re: ...Yet another m90 question

Issues will arise. Do you remember how far back your 3.4 sat in the engine bay? Its the same for a 3.8. Now, imagine sticking a supercharger on top of that, doesn't really fit, does it?

Bah.....that was years ago when I didnt know a damn thing about a car. I popped the hood a couple times and thats about all of the engine bay I saw. Two months after owning it, I got in an accident:rant: . I know the engine bays from my Grand Prix differ from a 4th Gen Fbody, but if it has been done before, it will fit....right? Like I said its a project car, not a daily driver so if I do go through with this, it will work someway or another.

Im not badmouthing Powerdyne (I have no right to, since I havent experienced anything yet) but what is so appealing about running 6-7 pounds of boost and still running the same kind of dyno numbers as the m90 kit from ZZP? The only difference I saw was that, ZZP's m90 kit dynoed just over 300ft/#s and Powerdyne came to 260ft/#s. That is of course with just using the L36 and doing a top end swap. The pullies from my car and the project car would be interchangeable with my car and I already have previous experience with the L67/m90.

I bet some of you guys are saying "whats wrong with this tool? Save yourself the trouble and get an LS1." Well, it would be more interesting to have a s/c Firebird then having an LS1. Although these cars are considered sportscars, it would KIND of fit into the category of a sleeper and it would surprise a lot of people as well.

At this point (early in research) Im thinking L67/Holden m90 swap or bust

[iGoRa]

Re: ...Yet another m90 question

go ahead and let us know how did it go.

[97rs4life]

Re: ...Yet another m90 question

yea go for it, just make sure you don't disappear when you realize it doesn't work like the other 5+ that started that project and never tell us their problems they ran into or anything. If it does work, cool, get some pics of your cut windshield and such to make it fit for us.

We tell you to go with a powerdyne because it is simple, fairly cheap, and reliable. If you want bigger boost and #'s go with a procharger intercooled kit or turbo.

But yea, go for your m90 setup and keep tabs of the $$ you spend on it.

[Turbo V6 Camaro]

Re: ...Yet another m90 question

turbo > all

[99v6cam]

Re: ...Yet another m90 question

The manual trans is weak as hell, only rated to 300ft lbs. If you plan on making the car into a fast drag car either get a g-force build for the manual or get an auto.

[Turbo V6 Camaro]

Re: ...Yet another m90 question

The manual trans is weak as hell, only rated to 300ft lbs. If you plan on making the car into a fast drag car either get a g-force build for the manual or get an auto.

thats 3rd gear i don't think 4th has been broke yet

[ReD715]

Re: ...Yet another m90 question

turbo > all

Yea I know. Turbos have a lot more potential then superchargers. Id like for it to get into 11s, 10s might be pushing it since I probably wont have enough clearance for an intercooler. I would be VERY happy if even a short stack fit but oh well. In MY opinion whine>whoosh :naughty:.

yea go for it, just make sure you don't disappear when you realize it doesn't work like the other 5+ that started that project and never tell us their problems they ran into or anything. If it does work, cool, get some pics of your cut windshield and such to make it fit for us.

We tell you to go with a powerdyne because it is simple, fairly cheap, and reliable. If you want bigger boost and #'s go with a procharger intercooled kit or turbo.

But yea, go for your m90 setup and keep tabs of the $$ you spend on it.

Im hoping you guys saw my first post. I said I was getting one in the near future (2-3 years). Right now its just homework time on what year would be most beneficial, what transmission is stronger, gears, what is needed, and things like that. Ill still be on these boards but not too active since I dont have too much experienced input on the cars.

How about the automatic trans while were at it? How much of a beating can that take? Will it bolt up to an L67? Has it never been tested or has anyone ever shared their experience with the L67 on this forum?

Right now Im thinking of a 98 5 speed Firebird with all of the options with a blown motor. Im not in a rush now but eventually Ill come across one. The Wide Open feature for the DHP PT is good for all 98-02 3800 motors and the 98s are the oldest of the body style.

[asdf1234]

Re: ...Yet another m90 question

I didn't read the thread, but I have an L67 block in my Camaro, if that answers one of your questions.

There aren't any problems mating the shortblock to anything.

[ReD715]

Re: ...Yet another m90 question

Ok good. That helps me out a lot:)