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I don't disagree with that. A 3.4 can definately go fast, you're proof of that Tiago... I'm just saying that a 3.8 is a better base engine to start with than a 3.4 and has more potential.
There are 4 13 sec NA 3.8's now... thats bad *** .
Keith - Chicago<br /><a href=\"http://www.hptuners.com\" target=\"_blank\">HP Tuners - PCM Reprogramming</a><br /><a href=\"http://www.dxsoftware.com/magnus/\" target=\"_blank\">97 Firebird V6 to LS1 swap</a><br /><b>V8 9.967@132.78</b> 1.322 60\' NA Heads/Cam<br /><b>V8 10.295@128.48</b> 1.363 60\' NA Cam Only<br /><b>V8 10.987@119.31</b> 1.422 60\' NA Stock Internals<br /><b>V6 13.674@98.22</b> NA<br /><b>V6 12.394@104.91</b> N20 100HP
<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Tiago:
I dunno someone should look it up for us.
the only reason why tehre is a 3.8 in teh 10s is because someone put money into it , plain and simple. If someone puts money in a 3.4 it will go fast too. yay.<hr></blockquote>
Exactly!
Same resaon why the Mustangs are faster then the 3.8L series II, more money and time has been invested.
I am not stupid stock for stock, the 3.8L is somewhat faster, the same timelist you boast has
15 people running 15.9s and higher, and I know for a fact there are more people like that just don't have there times posted. 15.9, I hit with my intake and exhaust, 15.913, to be exact. I have seen in person, many upon many 3.8Ls running low 16s. Actually I can say out of all the 3.8Ls I have seen, they about 20 of them have run 16+ 1/4 miles some with mods, some stock.
My argument, is not that the 3.4L is the end of all engines, its not, cam in it is garbage, pistons are pretty dumb as well. But side by side with a 3.8L, I don't think there is that much of a difference. And definitely not enough of a difference to warrant a motor swap to a 3.8L.
Maybe a 3.8L swap is an idea, if you blow your motor, but I still think even then its a bad idea.
I don't believe the guy got every thing he needed for the swap for $610. What is that a $250 tranny, $250 motor, $110 PCM, All with 50k on them? Which is still not everything he needed. I think that kind of cheap assuming he had not hook up.
Its the fact you are swapping the entire powertrain of the car. I think it woudl be cheaper to keep the swap with a 3.4L. Or go if you want the performance upgrade go up to a 3.8L.
As for the Good times the 3.8Ls are making there are still some peopel that need to go to the track. I honestly don't think the fastest 4th gen v6 is gong to be a 3.8L shortly.
Actually i got computer, all accessories, wiring harness, exhaust to the y, engine mounts with 53k on the engine. Awesome condition on all of it, nothing broke for $610 shipped. My current 4l60e mounts and works great with it.
2005 Ford Focus ZX3 SE D20 M5 - Modified ;) <a href=\"http://www.knightenmotorsports.com\" target=\"_blank\">http://www.knightenmotorsports.com</a> <br />[ U R L = h t t p : / / w w w . g e o c i t i e s . c o m / h e a r t l a n d _ h e a t _ v 6 ] Heartland Heat V6 [ / U R L ]
One more thing, Mustang V6s are not better than the 3800SII. I had a 2000 mustang and my 1995 3.4L camaro would smoke it. You gotta do gearing and mods to make it even keep up. (the mustang is gone, i bought a corvette..the camaro is my play car)
2005 Ford Focus ZX3 SE D20 M5 - Modified ;) <a href=\"http://www.knightenmotorsports.com\" target=\"_blank\">http://www.knightenmotorsports.com</a> <br />[ U R L = h t t p : / / w w w . g e o c i t i e s . c o m / h e a r t l a n d _ h e a t _ v 6 ] Heartland Heat V6 [ / U R L ]
<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by speedracer95v6: One more thing, Mustang V6s are not better than the 3800SII. I had a 2000 mustang and my 1995 3.4L camaro would smoke it. You gotta do gearing and mods to make it even keep up. (the mustang is gone, i bought a corvette..the camaro is my play car)<hr></blockquote>
Exactly made my point... Lesser motor with money invested goes faster...
There are v6 stangs in the 11s, and a local guy running 12s off the juice.
2005 Ford Focus ZX3 SE D20 M5 - Modified ;) <a href=\"http://www.knightenmotorsports.com\" target=\"_blank\">http://www.knightenmotorsports.com</a> <br />[ U R L = h t t p : / / w w w . g e o c i t i e s . c o m / h e a r t l a n d _ h e a t _ v 6 ] Heartland Heat V6 [ / U R L ]
2000 Firebird. Whisper Lid, True duals, TSP mail order tune, Built Tranny , TCI 2800 stall verter, B&M tranny cooler, Eaton LSD, 3.42 gears. Current best ET. 15.232 89.09 MPH 2.175 60ft on stock 3.42\'s and open diff.<a href=\"http://www.geocities.c
<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by HAZ-Matt:
A post that actually is not completely idiotic in this thread!
This has become the stupidest thread that I have ever seen on the board. Here are the facts:
2. Russell does not have a stock engine, or a factory engine, or an engine that was ever designed by GM Powertrain. <hr></blockquote>
i never said i HAD a stock engine. i said i had an engine that was similar in build to a 3400 engine. SIMILAR to a stock 3400. i never said it was a stock 3400. my engine is a hybrid of a 3.4 and gen III 60* block parts. (heads,etc) - never said it was a stock 3400.
the only thing i ever stated was that the parts are in stock condition - ie - as they came from the factory. i havent ported/polished or touched anything. i bought the parts i have from junkyards, ebay, everything as it came off of a stock Gen III 60* block. i then went to enourmous lenghts to make them perform so much better - i painted the engine. woo... then, in a fit of performance, i bought the ****tiest headers known to the performance world, and since i wanted the car to completely scream, i bolted the whole exhaust system together instead of welding it cause you know, if you bolt it tight enough, it does better than welding. o yea, and dont forget my jerry-rigged little EGR pipe thats on there, or that I went to painstaking lengths to keep the stock 50mm tb from the 3100 intake manifold i bought.
i couldnt have gotten more performance or more non-stock than that..wow...o yea..and dont forget my MSD DIS-4 - that isnt even hooked up, cause yanno, just having it in the engine bay gives me an extra 40 hp. forget all the otehr stuff i did. o yea, and i had the engine rebuilt to stock too...when i could have put in forged pistons and raised the compression, i *****ed and moaned to make sure they made it the same specs as a stock 3.4
so my engine is nowhere..i mean nowhere - ABSOLUTELY NOWHERE near any factory spec ever. i mean i couldnt even compare any of the parts to the parts that come out of GM Powertrain.
o yea -- dont hate just cause my car is better than yours.
post whatever you want, im done with this stupid fu(kin thread, and this whole stupid fu(king board
getting tired of the bickering on here.
say whatever...dont care anymore, i know the truth and i know that no 3.8 on this board will ever make it faster than the 12's. ever. unless tiago has worked on it. cause none of you know how - and all of you give up.
the 3.4 will ALWAYS be better than the 3.8. no one has looked at it long enough to realize that.
<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Magnus: If the 3.4 is better, let me see a 3.4 do 13's NA with a stock bottom end., hell let me see a streetable 3.4 do 13's NA period.<hr></blockquote>
thats more of an overall car/driver package issue then just the motor.
if you wanna compare solely motor to motor, lets see dynos, thats the onlything that ccan compare just the motor to another.
not saying one is better then the other but still going by the same logic you are in a way. Who has beat my dyno numbers? noone ;) 3.4 must be better then eh?
<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Tiago:
thats more of an overall car/driver package issue then just the motor.
if you wanna compare solely motor to motor, lets see dynos, thats the onlything that ccan compare just the motor to another.
not saying one is better then the other but still going by the same logic you are in a way. Who has beat my dyno numbers? noone ;) 3.4 must be better then eh?<hr></blockquote>
Nope the TURBO OWNSJOOO.. [img]smile.gif[/img]
2000 Firebird. Whisper Lid, True duals, TSP mail order tune, Built Tranny , TCI 2800 stall verter, B&M tranny cooler, Eaton LSD, 3.42 gears. Current best ET. 15.232 89.09 MPH 2.175 60ft on stock 3.42\'s and open diff.<a href=\"http://www.geocities.c
This is outta control. I think that both are equal IF you look at Tiago's turbo 3.4 and look at Shane's turbo 3.8 you will see that both have good performance. If you compare a basic bolt on 3.8 to a 3.4, the 3.8 will be superior because the 3.8 makes more power to start with.
97 Camaro RS<br /><br />\"Just a V6 huh?, let\'s go find out how slow it is\"
<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Russell: i never said i HAD a stock engine. i said i had an engine that was similar in build to a 3400 engine. SIMILAR to a stock 3400. i never said it was a stock 3400. my engine is a hybrid of a 3.4 and gen III 60* block parts. (heads,etc) - never said it was a stock 3400.<hr></blockquote>
Thanks for agreeing with me. What is sad is that I thought your hybrid engine was one of the coolest things on this site. It's ashame that you come off as arrogant as you say the 3.8L guys are.
<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Russell: my car is a stock "hybrid" 31/3400. when i get the 3400 intake and plenum (+10 hp diff. - bigger plenum and intake runners) i will have a STOCK 3400 sitting in my car with the only difference being the more radical camshaft from the RWD engine. now, my engine will be a stock 3400 engine making 200 hp (210?) and 245+ tq - stock. just like the stock 3.8L (3800) makes 200 / 225. so.. if a STOCK 3400 with a rwd cam in it, makes 200 hp, the same as a stock 3.8L...why is the 3.8 better?<hr></blockquote>
You keep emphasizing that you have a stock 3400 then add a disclaimer.
Let's pretend that you started off with a stock 3400. In the Monte Carlo it is rated at 180HP and 205ftlbs. So it starts out 20HP and 20ftlbs behind the 3800SII's rating. So you have added a cam, headers, and increased compresion from 9.5 to 9.6. Oh I have seen the light! The L32 is superior to the L36 based on the output of a modified 3400.
[ November 05, 2003: Message edited by: HAZ-Matt ]</p>
Hey everyone! I've been trying to remove my transmission for two days now! I need to replace the clutch. Only thing I've got left holding the transmission...
4 weeks ago
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