Isopropyl alcohol

[Darknight]

Ok, I know this is going to sound crazy, but here goes. I have an '88 Delta 88 Olds, with minor mods, and Series I 3800. Anyway, I've always known the car runs better with some alcohol in it, so tonight I tried a stronger mix. I put 2 quarts of 70% isopropyl alcohol into the tank, which had about 3.5 gallons of 93 octane already. Well, I ain't kiddin, I got at least .28 seconds off my 0-60 time, and it was about 80* outside with heavy fog, which means about 100% humidity. I don't recommend mixing it quite as strong (I was using it to help clean out the fuel system), and I do recommend using the 91% alcohol, but it really gave a noticeable difference both with the SOTP and the stopwatch.

Using alcohol lowers the combustion temps, which helps draw in a denser air/fuel charge, which makes more power, of course. Isopropyl alcohol and water also raises the octane rating. If you can't afford racing gas, and/or you have a forced induction engine, I recommend adding isopropyl alky from walmart or wherever you find it the cheapest. It also adds thermal efficiency, giving better mpg.

DK

[Brandon H]

YEAH I HAVE A 68 FIREBIRD AND SOMEONE TOLD ME TO PUT THAT IN THE TANK TO HELP IT TO PASS EMMISIONS. BUT WHEN I ASKED A FREIND WHO WAS A EXPERIENCED MECHANIC HE SAID HE HAS SEEN ENGINES BLOW UP WITH JUST ALITTLE IN THE TANK. ALSO IT CAN HURT YOUR FUEL PUMP IF IT IS ELECTRIC. BE CAREFULL.

[camaro_speedemon]

Um....Somehow I don't think putting alcohol in with the gas is a very good idea...

[hockeyman]

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by camaro_speedemon:
Um....Somehow I don't think putting alcohol in with the gas is a very good idea...<hr></blockquote>

[img]graemlins/thumbsup.gif[/img] I agree. I just have the feeling that something in the engine will not like it.
Murphy's Law always haunts me:
"Whatever can go wrong, WILL".

-Marc

[Darknight]

Ok, isopropyl alcohol is actually better suited for engines than ethanol, by far. It's less prone to knock, and has a higher energy density. It can also absorb a higher amount of heat, and run cooler. Sea Foam has 2-Propanol, which is the same as isopropyl alcohol. Around here, adding a little to the tank is a pretty well known and safe practice, even if it isn't elsewhere.

Given that, chemically, isopropyl alcohol is superior for internal combustion engines to ethanol, and most engines can run up to 10% ethanol without problems, tell me again how running a little isopropyl will blow up my engine?

People operate off way too much hearsay, and not enough fact.

This is a safe practice, if done with sanity. I don't advocate running a ratio as high as what I ran. I say about a quart for every 4 gallons would do nicely.

DK

P.S. And the water wouldn't hurt it either. It only adds thermal efficiency. Since it's dissolved in the alcohol, which is dissolved in the gasoline, it won't hurt the pump either.

[ August 06, 2003: Message edited by: Darknight ]</p>

[Darknight]

I'm also not advocating running isopropyl alcohol all the time...just occasionally. It wouldn't be worth the extra dollar for everday use, but it could make a difference at the track.

DK

P.S. By the way, not only does Sea Foam have isopropyl alcohol, but Iso-Heet does as well. It'll help take any moisture out of your system(five times better than methanol), and help the car to start in the winter.

[ August 06, 2003: Message edited by: Darknight ]

[ August 06, 2003: Message edited by: Darknight ]</p>

[Lord_Verminaard]

My old 91 Beretta 3.1 was running crappy last winter so I used four bottles of Iso-heet, on that tank I got an extra 15 miles out of the tank. It's also an old "secret" to run Isopropyl to pass the sniffer emission test. I've seen a 305 Camaro with no catalytic converters pass the sniffer with the help of high octane and isopropyl. [img]smile.gif[/img] Luckily for him, there was no visual test. ;)

Brendan
2000 L36 M49

[hockeyman]

Not putting you down Darknight, but I was just saying that I have never heard of doing that to my car.
With facts, yes, they do speak louder than hearsay, I agree. But I'll need to see a little more people trying this in order to convince me...
My car runs good now, and I would love to try adding alcohol to the gas, but my post about Murphy's Law above says it all.

-Marc

[Darknight]

Hey it's ok. I understand. I'm skeptical about many things too, until proven. Yet, if you know the basic background science, it helps clear up a good many doubts, and proves other doubts true.

Anyway, it runs good in my car, haha. [img]smile.gif[/img]

DK

[Jason McCallister]

That is very old school, Darknight... :D Very common to the folks running carbed engines trying to pass emissions back in the 70's. [img]graemlins/thumbsup.gif[/img]

[3.4 slow to go]

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Jason McCallister:
That is very old school, Darknight... :D Very common to the folks running carbed engines trying to pass emissions back in the 70's. [img]graemlins/thumbsup.gif[/img] <hr></blockquote>

let's see how a FI car does w/it ;)

f'ing e-check nazis, die all of you :mad: :mad: :mad:


edit: Iso alky in the windshield wiper tank helps keep it from freezing in winter

[ August 06, 2003: Message edited by: 3.4 slow to go ]</p>

[John_D.]

Something to think about, could the water precipitate out of the alchohol, in the tank?

In winter weather you could get a frozen fuel line as a result...

Seems like 90% and up would be safer than 70%. If you're going to do it at all.


(I'm really kinda curiuos about this now!) [img]smile.gif[/img]

[Darknight]

Isopropyl alcohol has the ability to dissolve and hold 5 times its own weight in water. That water doesn't come out of solution, even in freezing weather. I know it's old school for a lot of us, which is why I was surprised to see people afraid to use it. I've used it before, but not in those amounts, so I wanted to see how it performed, especially in the very muggy conditions around here.

Water and alcohol injection is widely used with turbos, to cool incoming air charge, and decrease the knock likelihood. My Series I 3800 computer constantly uses readings from the IAT to adjust the ignition timing on the fly, so the few degrees of advance I've tricked it into can pay off with the higher octane ratings brought with isopropanol. I also figured my fuel system could use some cleaning. After some 320k miles, it deserves it. I used to use Sea Foam, which works great too.

Anyway, even for a N/A engine, occasionally using isopropanol has its advantages, besides more power. It's long been used in many fuel and oil additives, mainly as a detergent, water remover and rust preventative.

DK

[Bliggida]

Gas mixing is usually only seen by the most serious of racers. Its not something any mechanic can do.

There is a lot of math, and chemistry built into mixing gas. This comes second to having a complete understanding of the internal combustion engine, the combustion chamber, compression ratio's, timing, air and fuel ratio. etc. You must not know about these things, you must know them.

Its never a hit or miss deal - you blow engines that way. Everything must be calculated and precise. Not to mention anytime you are handling fuel no matter how safe, you are putting yourself at a noteable level of risk.

If you want to get started, I suggest reading your owners manual. It does state that you can add up to 10, 12, or sometimes 15% Ethanol, alcohol with your unleaded pump gas.

[Darknight]

If you're adding something like methanol or nitromethane to a supercharged carbureted engine, then yeah, you have to know every variable. Yet, with our types of systems, simply adding a quart to every 4 or 5 gallons of gasoline is not much of a risk. Since our FI systems are constantly monitoring knock, timing, fuel and air, small alterations in the fuel formula are easily compensated by the computer. And again, isopropanol is actually less prone to detonation than gasoline, so you're actually safer than with your standard gasoline.

By the way, I still don't like ethanol. Isopropanol is superior in every way for combustion in our cars. The only REAL reason ethanol is used at all is to help support corn farmers. It's a favorite campaign subject for politicians travelling through the midwest, "More ethanol for cars keeps our farmers in business!" Well, I love and respect farmers, but ethanol just isn't a very practical approach to fuel. That land could be better used to grow non-hybrid, non-genetically modified food varieties, so we're not as dependant on two or three staple crops which would leave us in deep trouble if they failed, but that's another story...

DK

[ August 06, 2003: Message edited by: Darknight ]</p>