Getting back into the V6 Crowd...

[Need4Camaro]

and getting a new toy... It's a 99 Dark Navy Blue Firebird 3.8 WITH A 5 SPEED... I've always wanted a stick...

I'm ganna leave it mostly stock and just save some money while I complete college. What I want to know is when I'm ready to mod, I want to go alittle bigger than boltons and this is because I used to drive an LS1 so I still kind of have a crave for power. Don't get me wrong, these motors are still stout even by todays standards, but I'll still want more...

What do you think is the best way to go?

My goal is to have atleast 370 HP at the fly wheel...

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Handicaps - regardless of what I do, I want to keep the stick shift...
No Nitrous - It's a cheap power adder but I want something I can rely on while on the street too...
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Option #1 - LS1 Swap, 6 Speed Transmission, LID-SSRA, Full Exhaust (Long Tubes, Hi-Flow Cats, True Duals if possible) 12 Bolt Rearend with 3.42's, 17" Front - 18" Rear Wheels, Aluminum Driveshaft, Stiffer Suspension/Sway Bars, Possibaly a mild cam, Tune.

Option 1 should easily net me 370 HP or more - will once again put me in the LS1 stadium and I'll still have plenty of potential left... ...I am definately going to have a second car by then though and it will likely be a Toyota Prius so gas wont be a concern for this car...
-Problem is, I've never done a motor swap...
-Is there any possible way btw to keep using the 125 MPH Speedometer?

Option #2 - Turbo - P&P Intake Manifold, Forged Internals, Heads/Cam for low compression, Turbo, Full Boltons, 12 Bolt with 3.73 Gears, Aluminum Drive Shaft, 18" Rear, 17" Front Wheels, Stiffer Suspension/Sway Bars, Dyno Tune.

Option 2 really makes things interesting. I like the ability to drive like a regular V6 and probably save gas until after 3K RPMS where I can lurch off... But how much boost would I need to run to get my 370 Flywheel HP goals... If I can't attain them, should I go with 4.10's? Most importantly of all, will the 5 Speed beable to take the abuse and if not - where can I have it biult to handle the power? Also are there any "stroker" cranks that you could run with a Turbo setup to gain more low-end tourque?

Option #3 - N/A - P&P Intake Manifold, Heads, Cam, 4.3L Stroker Kit, LID/SSRA, Full Exhaust, 3.73 Gears, Aluminum Drive Shaft, 18" Rear, 17" Front Wheels, Stiffer Suspension/ Sway Bars, Dyno Tune.

Option 3 - Will it make enough power? How reliable will it be? Will 4.10's conpensate for the difference in HP in terms of accelleration if I can't make it to my power goal? Will the 5 Speed beable to handle it and if not can it be biult to?

[notsonic]

Re: Getting back into the V6 Crowd...

unless you build up the 5 speed, theyre only rated to handle around 300ft-lbs.

if you didnt get the car yet, and want a manual and lots of power, why not just get the ls1 from the start?

[cam98aro]

Re: Getting back into the V6 Crowd...

i say go for an ls1 w/ t56

[Shodown]

Re: Getting back into the V6 Crowd...

LS1 swap...too expensive. You'll haves to swap so much stuff that its just ridiculous. Just buy a car with an LS1 in it already.

Turbo option...depending on the turbo and cam grind you could EASILY get that kind of power anywhere between 10-15 psi. Lots of factors there, but definitely obtainable. You need to do some research on in the FI section too cuz high gears such as 3.73's or 4.10's are NOT good for a turbo car...at all. Turbo cars work best with 3.23's, 3.42's at the very most. Hell, some GN dudes use 3.08's and run 11's. Yes, stroker kits are available.

N/A option...you'll never get quite 370 hp even with a nasty cam/heads and stroker. I just dont see that happening.


BUT, none of this will be worth your time or money with the brittle 5 speed tranny. I've known people who blew them up with just bolt-ons. I've also known people who had them built by G-Force and still blew them up with power-adders. For this platform...auto > manual.

[Crazed98Camaro]

Re: Getting back into the V6 Crowd...

Watch this thread...

http://forum.camarov6.com/showthread.php?t=92884

Linux made 614 hp on 18 psi before the motor was all tore down.

With other options, Built turbo would be my opinion.

[cam98aro]

Re: Getting back into the V6 Crowd...

BUT, none of this will be worth your time or money with the brittle 5 speed tranny. I've known people who blew them up with just bolt-ons. I've also known people who had them built by G-Force and still blew them up with power-adders. For this platform...auto > manual.

the way i see it, he wants a manual so he can actually be in control of the car

i feel so much safer in a manual than i do an auto

[pace2006]

Re: Getting back into the V6 Crowd...

Why not upgrade to a 6 speed? Best of both worlds... manual and stronger than standard 5 speed.

Not going to say that you shouldn't do a LSX swap, but it would be cheaper and easier to trade in that car for one with the engine already in it once you get through college. I say see what condition the car is in once your done and then make a decision. But for now it doesn't hurt to think ahead.

[landj]

Re: Getting back into the V6 Crowd...

Well I definitely see a mistake brewing here. Definitely need to go with the Chevy Volt when you finish college or go E85. I don't think you can go wrong either way with a 3.8 now and selling latter or finding another LS1 or modding the 3.8 later. The 3800 engine is a solid, powerful, fuel efficient engine (that was also the first v6 to be certified as a ULEV) with many modifications available.

It's hard to plan that far in advance, but definitely not a Geo Metro with extra batteries...

[Shodown]

Re: Getting back into the V6 Crowd...

the way i see it, he wants a manual so he can actually be in control of the car

i feel so much safer in a manual than i do an auto

You feel unsafe in an auto? Im sorry, but thats...weird.

He can have a manual in a powerful car, thats fine and dandy. But I'll be the first person to say "I told you so" when it grenades time after time ;)

Why not upgrade to a 6 speed? Best of both worlds... manual and stronger than standard 5 speed.

There is only ONE V6 fbody with a T56 and thats Linxs. It took months to do and LOTS of custom fabrication. Its not just a simple swap.

[cam98aro]

Re: Getting back into the V6 Crowd...

You feel unsafe in an auto? Im sorry, but thats...weird.

He can have a manual in a powerful car, thats fine and dandy. But I'll be the first person to say "I told you so" when it grenades time after time ;)



There is only ONE V6 fbody with a T56 and thats Linxs. It took months to do and LOTS of custom fabrication. Its not just a simple swap.

i dont feel like i am in control of the car, but the car is in control of me

and does a v6 even have enough torque to get moving with an t56

[VenomZ]

Re: Getting back into the V6 Crowd...

a v6 and a v8 camaro are ''rated'' at about the same tq... the v6 has roughly 300 and the v8 more around 320...

so you shouldnt have a problem taking off...thats why 1st gear is taller.

and why even hassle with the time and money its going to take to put in a 6 speed? you can already see its a PITA...just build up the 5 speed...its not like your going to make enough power to actually torch it.

[Shodown]

Re: Getting back into the V6 Crowd...

.its not like your going to make enough power to actually torch it.

If he puts a turbo on it, its very likely that he could torch it. TurboV6Camaro went thru 2 built G-Force trannies (finally swapped a Performabuilt auto) and Linxs went thru several as well (later he custom fitted a T56). ssms4411 blew his up too with nitrous and swapped in an auto.

I'm not trying to p!ss in anyone's cheerios here. I just want to give fair warning that the T5's are fairly brittle and cant take too much abuse, even built ones when it comes to FI or nitrous.

[ssms5411]

Re: Getting back into the V6 Crowd...

^ Actually my M5 blew up running the powerdyne at 9-10 psi, I had a Spec+3 clutch with ceramic upgrade , was dynoed before the 928 rebuild at 288 HP and 330 TQ , blew up 3rd gear getting on it on the highway, swaped in another M5 babied it when I got rid of the powerdyne and put on Nitrous, due to medical problems put in a 02' A4 9,000 miles on it. With a Transgo shift kit and Vette servo, Ran a .055 wet shot for about a year, then now just runing it as a dry shot with a .055 jet and have my .063 and .071 to run when the weather cools here in about a month or two. I'm glad I switched to the auto, with Hptuners and the shift kit, it shifts better than I could with a stick. When this tranny goes, a Performbuilt will be going in with a 3000 stall. If your going for power over 300 hp I would go with a A4.

[cam98aro]

Re: Getting back into the V6 Crowd...

a v6 and a v8 camaro are ''rated'' at about the same tq... the v6 has roughly 300 and the v8 more around 320...

so you shouldnt have a problem taking off...thats why 1st gear is taller.

and why even hassle with the time and money its going to take to put in a 6 speed? you can already see its a PITA...just build up the 5 speed...its not like your going to make enough power to actually torch it.

thats a pretty funny joke

i hope your not serious...

[ssms5411]

Re: Getting back into the V6 Crowd...

thats a pretty funny joke

i hope your not serious...

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