Urgent: Headlights not working at night

[Scarano]

I was over at my brother's place today and we gave my new 97 firebird a nice wax job. I just picked it up yesterday and hadn't driven it at night yet. Anyways, it night time now and I am heading home.. I start the car and release parking brake and put the car into gear, but no pop up headlights to be seen. I flip the headlights switch all the way to the right, nothing. So, I have to drive about 40 miles with my hazards on. While I was driving home, I was playing with the switch and I even stopped and started the car again, but the lights would not engage. Funny thing is, the lights popped up once or twice automatically when I was test driving the car, and in my underground garage. But the switch never worked for me.

I was pissed off thinking about the car dealership as I was driving home, barely able to see and worrying I might get hit or hit something. The dealer saftied/certified the car for me, so according to ministry of transport they are supposed to check for these kind of things. How in the @#$% do they miss a major safety issue like the headlights switch not working? Jesus.

I am certainly going to be contacting the dealer to get them to fix this. But before I do I was wondering if anyone has experienced this problem and if you can offer any input on what the problem might be.

If its going to be a rather technical or more involved diagnosis, I would rather just take my car to Pontiac rather than have the dealer's shadowy service shop and mechanics noodle around with the car.

Thanks in advance [img]smile.gif[/img]

[95FirebirdConvertible]

You could have lifted up the hood and put your headlights up manually. Thats what you do when they are not working automatically. Driving with no headlights at night is very dangerous. Well sometimes if I turn the switch all the way to the right, twice really fast, they will come up the second time. Try that and see if that works.

[Scarano]

I have raised the lights manually only on one occasion -- while doing some work on an older 94 I used to own. But I was afraid if I opened them manually the lights (lamps) would not be lit, so why bother. If I get stuck having to drive again at night, I will take your advice though and raise them manually before I leave. I'll also try the fast switch thingy too. When I was doing the deal for the car, I did notice the switch was not engaging the popups, but at the time I was not 100% positive that the switch is supposed to pop-up the headlights every time. I was thinking that since they are automatic, it would not work in the daytime regardless if I used the switch or not.

Had I known that the switch is supposed to always raise the lights, I would have made extra sure to have the dealer service that issue. But anyways, they did certify my car, so the mechanics should have definitely checked this most basic requirement of a safety certification. Now I am beginning to wonder if they even did the engine oil, rad flush and trans flush that I negotiated as part of the deal. I'll have to check that too, and if I find they didn't do that either I am going to really give them ****.

Thanks.

[94Redbird]

Sounds like the problem is with the headlight module. I had the same problem except only one of my lights would pop up. When I took the module apart a transister for the side that wasn't working was fried. I bought a used module off ebay for 30 bucks shipped and it's been fine ever since. The module is located just below the fuse box on my 94. It's a sort of square flat box with 2 plugs going into it and it's held to the body of the car with two of those plastic screw in pins... which got to be the worst invention ever :rolleyes:

Just for the record the switch should work at all times even with automatic lights... I actually unhooked the sensor for the automatic lights too cause they were always poppin up when I didn't want them up. In the mean time the lights should be at least turning on so they will work if manually raised... so no need to be driving in the dark without lights.

[Scarano]

Hey Redbird, thanks for your reply and info. Someone a f-body hideout told me it might also be the switch itself or the headlights relay. Now this is why I don't really want to take the car back to the auto center that certified the car for the dealer. Even though they should fix this problem at no charge for me, because it is a safety item that should have been actioned during certification, I have little confidence in this auto center after speaking with the owner/mechanic this morning. He didn't sound too sure about the issue, and the last thing I want is to take my car to a hack to have tham start taking apart things or attempt to do a hack job to fix the problem. Some service shops out there are really bad. My brother recently sold his car to another of my younger brother's, and the place he took the car to perform the safety certification had to fix something with the horn. Well, when the car was done and my brother drove off, the car experienced a fire in the area where the did work on the horn. Luckily he was ok, but he had to take the car to this service center to fix the problem. Apparently when they fixed the horn, they did a hack job with the wiring and ****ed up alot of other things. Weird problems started happening like horn not working when applying brakes, rear defogger not working, temp control not working, car idling very low. Before the car was taken to this place, everything was functioning perfectly except for the horn, and we knew the original owner -- never any problems on this car. The place that did the work totally ****ed the vehicle up, and they were so incompetent at getting it fixed that they ended up dicking my brother around and keeping his car there for over 6 weeks! I don't want to get into this situation, that's why I have little faith in these little private service shops in doing work that is a little out of the scope of the traditional general mechanic work like brakes, oil changes, or other basic mechanical work.

I am thinking to just take my car to Pontiac and just pay for a diagnosis. But I might check out your advice on my own... sorry for this dumb question, but I haven't had to go into a firebird fuse box for a while, so where is the fuse box located? Is it accessible from the vehicle cabin or do I get to it from opening the hood? Once I find that I can locate the headlights module just below it.

Thanks again.

[94Redbird]

I'll tell you what... I'll take some pics when I get home from work and post them for you. I am 99% certain the module or wiring to it is you're problem because if it was just the switch chances are the automatic lights would still work. I'll have to check the circuitry to confirm that though. I don't think it would be a relay or motor because I'm pretty sure there is one relay per light and I know there are two motors. I'll get back to you ASAP.

[94Redbird]

Ok below are the pics of the module. I'm not sure if this will be the same for your car because it is a 3.8 but it may be because it is a 97. There is also a link attached for the wiring schematic of the headlights and switches but it doesn't actually show how the module ties in because the schematic is from a camaro which does not have pop up lights as I'm sure you're aware... but this will at least help you determine if the problem could be at the switch.
Also I mentioned relays in the earlier post... ignore that I got mixed up. There aren't any relays for the light motors but there are fuses so check those before you do anything because that would be the simplest problem to fix but again I doubt that's the problem because both fuses would have to be blown. Hope this helps and feel free to ask any questions if I've confused you. Good luck.

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...rd/lights1.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...rd/lights2.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...rd/lights3.jpg

http://shbox.com/1/headlight_chevy_1995.jpg

[Scarano]

That was mighty nice of you Redbird, thanks very much!! I am reviewing your photos now and I will take a look at the car tomorrow morning. I really appreciate you taking the time to take those photos [img]smile.gif[/img] Will keep you posted.