1999 Firebird Headers

[Zules]

I have a 3.8L 99' Firebird. I was wondering if these pacesetter headers would work best for my car.

(heres the link : http://www.autopartswarehouse.com/de...P40701209.html)

I have magnaflow exhaust. So will it still work with these headers?
And also does anyone know how much hp/torque I may gain with these?

[97rs4life]

Re: 1999 Firebird Headers

yea pacesetters will work on your car

[Zules]

Re: 1999 Firebird Headers

Cool, thanks. Oh and it says "header bolts not included" will I need those bolts for installation? If so where can I purchase them for my car?

[Smoke Panther]

Re: 1999 Firebird Headers

Cool, thanks. Oh and it says "header bolts not included" will I need those bolts for installation?

unless you intend to superglue the header flange to the car, yea

If so where can I purchase them for my car?

they can be found at any hardware store...header bolts aren't made of super-special alloy or anything...another member will probably chime in with the bolt size

[Shad0wguy]

Re: 1999 Firebird Headers

Our cars use 5/16-18x1". Pick up some grade 8 bolts in that size at your local hardware store and your all set.

[Sean_99_3.8]

Re: 1999 Firebird Headers

I would recommend getting coated headers and Abbot Gaskets.
My pacesetters came with header bolts

[michael454rs@hotmail.com]

Re: 1999 Firebird Headers

I would recommend getting coated headers

what would be the difference between the coated one and the black ones from the link

[Smoke Panther]

Re: 1999 Firebird Headers

what would be the difference between the coated one and the black ones from the link

about $240

[ssms5411]

Re: 1999 Firebird Headers

Coated are def. worth the extra money, my coated RKsport headers still look as good as new going on 8 years now.

[Zules]

Re: 1999 Firebird Headers

What do you mean by "def."? And still, does anyone know the average hp gain from these headers?

[97rs4life]

Re: 1999 Firebird Headers

What do you mean by "def."? And still, does anyone know the average hp gain from these headers?

def= definitely

[Smoke Panther]

Re: 1999 Firebird Headers

And still, does anyone know the average hp gain from these headers?

there is no definitive gain

[ssms5411]

Re: 1999 Firebird Headers

Posted from the other forum:

Sorry for the wait everyone, here it is. Video file is still uploading and converting. I'll post it up when it's done.

Detailed Dyno Results:
All tests were conducted on a completely stock vehicle with nothing forward of the exhaust system changing between tests. No tuning was conducted, and fuel trims were reset before driving to the dyno shop. The tests were accomplished on a Dynojet dyno, with the same operator handling all pulls. Due to the speed limiter still being enabled, all but the first pull were done in 3rd gear. We were unable to get a clean RPM signal for TQ readings on the stock pulls.

Stock (SAE Correction 1.03)
Details: 2000 Camaro, M5 w/no modifications down to the paper air filter
- Run 1: 169.15HP, 80.16* F, 29.09 in-Hg, 55% Humidity (4th gear)
- Run 2: 166.92HP, 81.15* F, 29.09 in-Hg, 54% Humidity
- Run 3: 167.55HP, 81.83* F, 29.10 in-Hg, 51% Humidity

Longtubes (SAE Correction 0.99)
LTs w/no catalytic converter (Dan’s setup) and the 13secV6 catback
- Run 1: 183.94HP/201.61TQ, 63.67* F, 29.25 in-Hg, 43% Humidity
- Run 2: 183.89HP/202.30TQ, 63.21* F, 29.25 in-Hg, 42% Humidity
- Run 3: 184.05HP/203.04TQ, 62.82* F, 29.26 in-Hg, 42% Humidity

Pacesetters (SAE Correction 1.00)
Pacesetters w/catalytic converter and the 13secV6 catback
- Run 1: 182.80HP/204.60TQ, 72.92* F, 29.27 in-Hg, 30% Humidity
- Run 2: 182.55HP/205.65TQ, 72.89* F, 29.28 in-Hg, 28% Humidity
- Run 3: 182.68HP/204.25TQ, 74.36* F, 29.29 in-Hg, 27% Humidity

Dyno and Installation Information:
Day 1: I arrived at 1400, we let the car cool and then went to the dyno. Upon completion of the test we cooled the car. Disassembly of the stock exhaust system and all components began at 1930 and disassembly was completed at 2125. Long tube installation began at this time and the revised driver’s side long tube was mounted.

Both Camaros were identical in regards to clearance with both sets of LTs. The header Dan originally received had approximately ¼”- 3/8” of clearance when mounted on my Camaro. Likewise, the revised header strikes my undercarriage just as it does on Dan’s. Once the LTs and y-pipe were fitted, we started work on the 13secv6 catback. This catback consists of:

- Summit Turbo muffler SUM-630230 3" offset in/out
- Dynomax Intermediate pipe 3", WLK-53061 and WLK 54064.

Due to the extreme fitment issue we encountered with the revised driver’s side LT header, we used Dan’s original driver’s side LT for the purpose of testing on the dyno. Work was completed at 0200.

Day 2: We finished up some small issues first thing in the morning and headed to the dyno. The best pull with the LTs was 184HP/203TQ. We cooled the car for a short period of time and began installation of the Pacesetters. The Pacesetters produced 182HP/205TQ.

Personal observations:
I do believe the LT’s are a great product. Aside from some necessary fixes, they work great. Even with the false KR hobbling the performance they still produced a better peak HP # than the Pacesetters. Once the clearance issue is fixed, these things will outshine the competition.

Once you look at the graph and see where the LT’s take off, it becomes apparent that the longtubes are way too much header for a stock vehicle. They flow like no other, which shifted the curve up higher into the RPMs. In my opinion, this hurt the peak TQ value. The scavenging really comes into play around 5100rpm and the peak HP comes in about 5300rpm. The Pacesetters peaked at approximately 5100rpm and quickly dropped off afterwards, unlike the LTs which continued a nice, steady curve.

Do I believe that you need tuning to make the most of these headers? No. I do believe that these headers will be most appreciated by those that do more than the basic bolt-ons, and as such these individuals will most likely have a tuner available. As such I recommend the LTs to those that are going to need the overhead. I will say that the bolt-on folks won't be disappointed with the performance, and they do sound dead sexy.

If people take anything away from this test, I want them to know that the LTs have great potential. Did we see it all on my car? No, thanks to a restrictive intake side and the false KR. The clearance issue is being worked as we speak by Tiago and Pat, and once that's cleared up and we regain the 8* of timing pulled by false KR, the results are going to be BANANAS. One last answer to the question I'm sure is on everyone's mind:

Yes, I miss the LTs.

Dyno charts:
Stock


Longtubes


Pacesetters


Longtubes vs Pacesetters


Comparison of all 3


Video:
http://www.fquick.com/videos/viewvideo.php?id=5454
__________________
2000 Onyx Black Camaro, M5 | 1998 Platinum Gray Metallic Buick Regal GS | 1999 Dark Blue Saturn SL2
"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell


GS Jon
View Public Profile
Send a private message to GS Jon
Send email to GS Jon
Find More Posts by GS Jon
Add GS Jon to Your Buddy List

[InfraredMonkey]

Re: 1999 Firebird Headers

I would recommend getting coated headers and Abbot Gaskets.
My pacesetters came with header bolts

My pacesetters came with bolts too, but in the end I got the Stage 8 header bolts off eBay, they have a metal plate that connects to the bolts, not allowing it to unbolt by resting against the header pipes. They work pretty well. I haven't had any issues.

I would second the gaskets, they are nicer than the paper gaskets you get from Pacesetters.

[Chevy16]

Re: 1999 Firebird Headers

order the headers from summit, they come with all bolts and hardware for about the same price, get some abbott gaskets, the ones pacesetter privides will definitely blow and leak. the ceramic coated headers, simply put are just way better. they hold heat better, wont rust, last a lot longer, and quit frankly look better when you pop the hood. the painted ones are just painted so they dont rust during the shipping process. once on the car and run through a few cycles the paint melts off and the headers will start rusting right away... ceramic are worth the extra money