Question..

[1998silverbird]

Has anyone that has lowered there car and installed lower control are relocation brackets, put the stock springs back in?? What effect will the brackets have on the stock height?? I too am getting sick ove bottoming out and banging my exaust..

[AllTheGoodNamesAreGone]

if you are bottoming out you really need stiffer springs or better shocks.. relocation brackets may help a little but you have a bigger problem at hand..

~Bill

[1998silverbird]

I already have good shocks and struts that are stiff its just these cars sit so damn low already. My question was with my relocation brackets welded in like they are right now what effect will the angle have on a stock heaght car??

[ June 29, 2003: Message edited by: 1998silverbird ]</p>

[AllTheGoodNamesAreGone]

stiffer springs! those eibach kits blow pretty hard as far as rear stiffness goes.. and they dont really lower the rear all that much.. IMO the eibach kits are crap, ls1 guys hate them to.. but atleast our kit dosent have as major of a sag issuse as the ls1 kit..

what shocks are you running?

~Bill

[ June 29, 2003: Message edited by: AllTheGoodNamesAreGone ]</p>

[1998silverbird]

No matter if I get stiffer springs or stiffer struts my front ends sits to low.. All I want to find out is will the relocation brackets hurt my performance on a stock height car since they made for lowered cars??

[Arctc Wolf]

they won't hurt, they help no matter what. what scrapes on ur car? is it the actuall body panels, or is it the air dam, subframes, ect?

[1998silverbird]

The front bumper, k member, y-pipe, subframe connectors, and of course tail pipes.. I am just getting really sick and tired of dodging speedbumps no matter how small they are, going into driveways sideways,hitting **** in the road.. The car looks really cool lowered and handles better but I have a 1 LE suspension with polyurathane bushings and I think thats enough for me.. and besides i am getting my new bumper on and ws6 hood and dont want to mess up the new bumper..

[PewterBird]

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by 1998silverbird:
No matter if I get stiffer springs or stiffer struts my front ends sits to low.. All I want to find out is will the relocation brackets hurt my performance on a stock height car since they made for lowered cars??<hr></blockquote>

Its kinda funny, how no one directly answered your question.

But anyway, I am no expert, but I do have some logic.
When you put lowering springs in, it changed the suspention geometry, thats why they recomemd relocation brackets. To fix it. I would think if you just had relocation brackets, with out the springs, you would be fixing a problem that no longer exist. Therefore creating a new problem. So I imagine it would throw off the suspention geometry, and if you really want a good performing suspention, I would change it back.

[1998silverbird]

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by PewterBird:


Its kinda funny, how no one directly answered your question.

But anyway, I am no expert, but I do have some logic.
When you put lowering springs in, it changed the suspention geometry, thats why they recomemd relocation brackets. To fix it. I would think if you just had relocation brackets, with out the springs, you would be fixing a problem that no longer exist. Therefore creating a new problem. So I imagine it would throw off the suspention geometry, and if you really want a good performing suspention, I would change it back.<hr></blockquote>

Yeah thats what I am thinking too.. When I first had my car lowered I wasnt able to get trackion at all untill I had them installed with the LCA's.. having less of a angle doesnt plant the rear end so you wheel hop.. having a bigger angle would?? Is there anything as planting the rear end to hard?? Lets try this question: what would happen if you put relocation brackets on a car that is not lowered?? [img]graemlins/thumbsup.gif[/img]

[V6Bob]

What a neat question. I learned a lot while researching the answer. Thanks.

When a car accelerates it tends to compress the rear springs (squat). That hurts acceleration. The suspension design puts in some anti-squat to counter this. But the engineers have to limit the amount, too much anti-squat causes the suspension to lock up (bind).

When you lower the car you lose some or maybe all of the anti-squat GM designs in. The relocation brackets get it back (and, depending on the exact distances lowered/relocated, maybe put some more anti-squat in).

When you use the relocation brackets on a stock height car, you're basically dialing in a whole lot of anti-squat. That might work well for a pure drag racing car, but it's not so good for cornering because of the suspension bind when you accelerate.

Because of all this, the best relocation brackets for suspension tuning on a competition car have multiple positions, which give different anti-squat settings.

[ June 30, 2003: Message edited by: V6Bob ]</p>

[1998silverbird]

Thank you.. I noticed on the brackets today that there are 2 angles to adjust too..

[Loochy88]

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by V6Bob:

When you use the relocation brackets on a stock height car, you're basically dialing in a whole lot of anti-squat. That might work well for a pure drag racing car, but it's not so good for cornering because of the suspension bind when you accelerate.


[ June 30, 2003: Message edited by: V6Bob ]<hr></blockquote>


I always thought that some squat was good for a drag car (at least on the launch??). I thought that was why some v8 fbody draggers put v6 springs in the rear???

[hou-tex-six]

They usually recommend the first (higher) setting to recoup angle lost from lowering, and the second for planting the rear even better. It will have no effect on your bottoming out whatsoever, and is perfectly fine for use without the lowering springs, maybe on the first setting, as this would equate to the second setting on a lowered car. Id just leave it at the lowest setting, but then again im not sure what the term "binding" means and what that translates to on the road, either way, it takes 30 mins to switch em from one to the other.

EDIT: From the Spohn website

NON-LOWERED vehicles will also see a dramatic increase in traction by lowering the rearward angle of the LCA with our relocation brackets. The lower mount holes are placed in the arc pattern of the OEM length LCA. Therefore allowing a non-lowered F-Body to drop the rear LCA angle and NOT require a longer than OEM LCA. All geometry is correctly maintained. The anti-squat performance is providing most users with a full .10 or better 60' reduction!


Cp

[ July 07, 2003: Message edited by: hou-tex-six ]</p>

[1998silverbird]

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by hou-tex-six:


EDIT: From the Spohn website

NON-LOWERED vehicles will also see a dramatic increase in traction by lowering the rearward angle of the LCA with our relocation brackets. The lower mount holes are placed in the arc pattern of the OEM length LCA. Therefore allowing a non-lowered F-Body to drop the rear LCA angle and NOT require a longer than OEM LCA. All geometry is correctly maintained. The anti-squat performance is providing most users with a full .10 or better 60' reduction!


Cp

[ July 07, 2003: Message edited by: hou-tex-six ]<hr></blockquote>

That is what I was wonderring.. Thanks for all the help.. anyone interested in buying some eibach lowering springs??

[Arctc Wolf]

to be exact w/ the suspension, adjustable lca's would be required. the more the lca's point towards the ground behind the car, the better the traction. Pure racers would use rod-ended suspension parts to alleviate bind when going to extremes like this.